THE FITNESS THREAD

[Chojin]

Okay, this is getting talked about more and I'm getting PMs about it, so let's keep it to this thread instead so the fatties don't revolt and leave us for brawl hall.

Read this before asking a question: http://www.liamrosen.com/fitness.html

I'm certainly not an expert, but I do a ton of reading on the subject from actual accredited fitness authors. When possible, I will link to actual experts and/or studies who support my assertions. I've also done this shit myself and have a good handle on what works and why. At the risk of inflating Pub's spank bank, here are the pictures of my personal progress since 2009:


http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/progress-090729.jpg
July '09 (235 lbs)

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/progress-090828.jpg
August '09

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/progress-090925.jpg
September '09

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/progress-091120.jpg
November '09

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/progress-100430.jpg
April '10

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/progress-100825.jpg
August '10

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/progress-110708.jpg
A couple minutes ago (178 lbs)

You can get better progress than this faster if you stick to your guns and aren't a dumbshit. I stopped working out for a few stretches of months during this time when I really didn't have to, and also took a complete break from watching my diet during the school year.
k, ask away.

[ItalianStereotype]

were people really crying about being told not to be fat anymore

[ItalianStereotype]

that's my fitness related question

[Chojin]

they were, and i advised them to go to planet fitness, where they can meet the rest of the fat acceptance movement

[ItalianStereotype]

fat friends, did you know they have BUCKETS of TOOTSIE ROLLS at planet fitness?

[ItalianStereotype]

also, you should love planet fitness because you actually have an excuse for always being sweaty

[Guitar Woman]

so you said I should do core-strengthening excercises for sick abs, what would be some examples aside from like crunches or whatever

I tried just googling it but that brings up a bunch of bullshit.

[Chojin]

fat friends, did you know they have BUCKETS of TOOTSIE ROLLS at planet fitness?

yes, they also have free pizza and free bagels day

i do love me some bagels though

MUSCLE IS FOR FAGS

Lift weights and stop eating candy

I think there's a disconnect on the meaning of the word "muscle". To people familiar with it, it means muscle tissue, which everyone has. To the layfag, it seems to mean "sweet biceps bro". Just think of muscle as the solid shit under your skin. To look like brad pitt in fight club or whatever your goals are, you will need muscle. I rly don't think I look xbox hueg and it's because I focus on a slimmer look myself.

You will also need to lose fat. The saying is that abs are made in the kitchen, and that's true for the most part. Body fat is almost entirely dependent on your diet. Eating less will cause you to drop in both fat and lean body mass (muscle tissue), which is why you need to prevent the latter from happening at all costs or you'll just end up slightly smaller and still pudgy. You prevent muscular atrophy by eating lots of protein and straining your muscle regularly.

Lifting free weights will take a good deal of dedication to learn to do it safely and effectively; tbh if you aren't willing to do that then you can go ahead and use machines. They're less effective in the long run, but squatting with a 2" range of motion and still throwing your back out is even less so.

Your diet is actually the biggest and hardest thing that will have to change if you want to lean up. You will need to learn to cook with certain essential ingredients; especially chicken breasts, ground beef, and lean fish. WOULD YOU LIKE TO KNOW MORE.

[Chojin]

Crunches are for fags and don't help for a variety of reasons. Those reasons have to deal with hypertrophy only being possible within a certain (smaller) range of repetitions and the range of motion on a crunch being fucktarded.

The best core lifts are the squat and deadlift. The deadlift is my very favorite lift and is deceptively simple. Really nothing can complete replace the squat and deadlift, and even if something could, it would involve 4+ lifts to accomplish what one lift would do for you instead. It's worth mentioning that my chiropractor has forbade me from doing squats for the time being, so I have had to work around it myself.

To get started without a gym membership or any equipment (ok maybe a doorframe chinup bar), check out convict conditioning. Here's an excerpt:

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/convictconditioning.jpg

pushups and handstands use your core as a stabilizer, squats and bridges will directly work the core. btw using weights is still much better, but if you're itching to do something right this very moment that picture can be helpful.

[ItalianStereotype]

planks
side crunches
knees to elbows
hanging leg raise
oblique twists
russian curls
toe drivers
axe chops
plate crunches
there's a lot you can do

also, if you're doing any other exercise, keep your core tight. compound exercises are your best friend though.

[Chojin]

a lot of those are isolation exercises that target specific muscles within the core. the spinae erector is pretty goddamn important and very few lifts target it (deadlift is one of them btw). the only bodyweight exercise that comes to mind for it is the superman, which is pretty much impossible to add weight to. i recently added leg raises to my routine because i needed more hip flexor work and would like to correct some of my hyperlordosis. i prefer to use the cable machines for it.

obliques i never really saw a point in targetting due to the way those muscles can square out your midsection.

[ItalianStereotype]

most of those are isolation, yes, but he can do a lot of those without going to a gym. I didn't even think about convict conditioning. I did a lot of that after my car accident and loved it.

if you do deadlifts, make sure you have someone around to teach you the proper form. it's easy to fuck up and can potentially be dangerous, but it's one of the most rewarding exercises you can do.

[Chojin]

oh oh i would be remiss to not mention the dragon flag as my favorite ab exercise

mjCMq2zkbOo

the exercise was invented by bruce lee. it also uses mad core stabilizers and looks cool. the problem with it is that you need to have a fucking strongggg core before you can even think about it. i currently do them with bent knees to keep my reps in the 3-5 range.

[k0k0]

I can't really afford a gym membership at the moment and right now I'm really only working out my legs and somewhat my arms by using an elliptical for about 30 minutes a day. One problem with me lifting weights is my nerves get pinched in my shoulder region so easily, so I've kind of laid off working on anything having to do with my arms other than punching a heavy bag every couple of days for 10 minutes. I'm 6'1 and 214 pounds right now, but trying to get that down a little bit. Not looking to be super muscly or anything, I just want to go back to being as skinny and awkward looking as I was when I was in my early 20's.

[ItalianStereotype]

if you look a few posts up, convict conditioning is actually really great for home based routine.

by lifting weights, you don't necessarily become a bear. it takes years and dedication to do that. everyone should lift, no exceptions.

[Chojin]

No amount of lifting is going to make you super-muscley if you aren't eating to support the growth. Since you're looking to lose weight, you're already in the clear.

Find out what's wrong with your shoulder. Get an xray, see a doctor. I injure my left trapezius and lower right of my back all the time, and it turned out to be caused by a 15-degree curve in my spine in those areas. I'm getting chiropract'd regularly now.

It's really impossible for me to give you workout advice if I don't know what aggravates your shoulder, but my educated guess is that if you just man the fuck up the problem will solve itself.

[ItalianStereotype]

yes, above all it's calories in versus calories out

[k0k0]

My shoulder problem is due to poor posture. I'm at home all day on the computer filling out medical claim forms for a shitty insurance company, so I guess I got a bit of a slouch. I am going to the chiropractor twice a week and have been for the past 3 weeks. So far people have told me I don't look like I'm as hunched over, which is a good start. If I lift something over 40 pounds, I'll sometimes get pinched nerves which results in me being in a lot of pain for over a week, which is why I haven't done anything with my arms other than the heavy bag. I am looking to do something other than the elliptical though, so I think that the convict conditioning may be a good thing for me since I'm usually stuck in the house all day. I don't eat much more than one meal a day with snacks around it ever since I found out I was allergic to wheat a month and a half ago. I think that's what has caused me to lose the most weight so far since most fast food places have wheat in their food so that isn't an option any longer. Again, I really appreciate this thread and am going to look into a lot of this stuff now.

[ItalianStereotype]

changing your diet will be a huge thing for you. a somewhat retarded, but very true saying: "abs are made in the kitchen, not the gym"

[Chojin]

terezi #2, i already said that

[ItalianStereotype]

D:

[Dimnos]

In an attempt to cut soda out I have started drinking water. However the clean flavorless taste gets a little boring sometimes. What is a good replacement for soda in addition to water? Personally I have been eyeing cranberry juice. Is this a dumb mistake?

[Zomboid]

I weigh between 150-160, and I've still got a couple of chub areas THAT MUST BE EXTERMINATED. I also don't want to go to a gym. I think I should just cut those areas off with a sharp steak knife.

[Esuohlim]

HEY CHOJIN (serious post coming up, get ready), what's your opinion on BURPEES? I don't have access to any gym equipment currently and I've heard good things

[Guitar Woman]

Also I still have no idea what the fuck all this jargon is or what any of these numbers mean

"Yeah bro do like 5x27 power cleans that shit is sick"

[ItalianStereotype]

zomboid: sorry brah, no such thing as spot reduction

kahl: you're overlooking the protein in the cheese, meat, and sauce. you have to really keep your eye on all of the health benefits of such a diet.

milhouse: burpees are okay, but I will do them as warm up. if you don't have gym equipment, do convict conditioning. you'll find it a few posts back.

gw: you'll be doing five sets of 27 cleans. pretty sick numbers, bro.

[Zomboid]

Break down exactly what those exercises you described are, and I'll do them.

NO SPOT REDUCTION?! So, I have to exercise everything to lose mah shit in a few areas? It's mainly excess skin from my awesome weight loss from high school (I started banging chicks shortly thereafter, bros!!! :rock).

[ItalianStereotype]

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/convictconditioning.jpg


This is where you'll find convict conditioning. all of those exercises are beyond self explanatory. Besides, don't you get enough exercise by ripping the black guts out of the Earth?

[ItalianStereotype]

also, if you're trying to fill out loose skin, you really need to focus on building muscle. muscle growth will tighten the skin up, but you might always have a little bit of the droopy pooch. convict conditioning probably isn't going to help you so much. do you have any decent gyms in your area?

[Zomboid]

I haven't done oil stuff in a while. I just finished a bunch of school and have my practicum left, braw. The broke student diet for me consisted of a lot of shitty cafeteria meals and a lot of drinking, but I lost weight. I'm basically just too skinny right now. Not so gaunt as, like, Fathom, but I don't have as much muscle as I used to.

[ItalianStereotype]

Then you need to get into a gym. People always say they want to lose weight or whatever, but nobody wants to do what is necessary to accomplish that. If you want to fill out, convict conditioning won't help you.

[Zomboid]

I basically just want to be more limber and slightly more toned while still being able to smoke. I don't want/need to get BRO big, bro.

[ItalianStereotype]

Bluh bluh I hear that all the time. Look, there's no such thing as just toning up and you don't just get big by picking up a dumbbell. Getting big takes time, a lot of effort, discipline and dietary commitment. Assuming you don't eat like shit, you lose fat as you build muscle and you'll be able to fill out your loose skin well before you turn into Ronnie Coleman.

[Zomboid]

Fine, fag.

[ItalianStereotype]

When I got back into the gym after my car accident, here's the routine I did to ease myself back into it:

A
Bench 3x5
Bent over rows 3x5
Overhead press 3x5
Deadlifts 1x5

B
Squats 3x8
Dumbbell lunges 3x8
Pullups 3x8
Leg press 3x8

I worked A/B/Rest/A/B/Rest etc. It's a simple routine that helped me get back to where I was before the accident. It's full of compound exercises with moderate reps and can help you when paired with a decent diet.

[kahljorn]

kahl: you're overlooking the protein in the cheese, meat, and sauce. you have to really keep your eye on all of the health benefits of such a diet.

ehhh i already get enough protein from all the cock i suck

[Aaarg]

In an attempt to cut soda out I have started drinking water. However the clean flavorless taste gets a little boring sometimes. What is a good replacement for soda in addition to water? Personally I have been eyeing cranberry juice. Is this a dumb mistake?

you know what i only just realized? you can cold brew bagged green tea just fine.

so now i just throw a teabag in a bottle of water and leave it in the fridge for a few hours.

f yea

[k0k0]

So I was trying to study the convict conditioning chart above, but some things were too tiny to read. I ended up getting the book and if you look past all the "hey dude, lifting weights is for fags, in prison you gotta be tough" talk, there's really detailed explanations on how to do each exercise and how to get from step 1 to 10 without killing yourself. I'd recommend getting it, even if it's through illegal means. The beginning exercises look easy enough for a novice such as I.

[Guitar Woman]

I want to go on the record as fucking loving those kneeling push ups. I thought they'd destroy my knees if I did more than, like, five, but I didn't even feel any strain on them and I was doing this on a concrete floor.

My arms also feel like they were torn up pretty good.

[Chojin]

In an attempt to cut soda out I have started drinking water. However the clean flavorless taste gets a little boring sometimes. What is a good replacement for soda in addition to water? Personally I have been eyeing cranberry juice. Is this a dumb mistake?

Cranberry juice is a terrible replacement for soda for a couple reasons: one, it has more calories; two, it has more acid. the main reasons people hate on soda are for its calories and acid. diet soda is actually perfectly goddamn fine and there are credible studies that have proven that phosphoric acid does not "leech calcium from the bones by lowering the stomach acid ph", as most broscientists will claim. I drink a lot of diet caffeine-free sodas myself, but caffeine is fine too if you aren't having a hypertension problem.

Sauce: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11522558

I weigh between 150-160, and I've still got a couple of chub areas THAT MUST BE EXTERMINATED. I also don't want to go to a gym. I think I should just cut those areas off with a sharp steak knife.

stubborn fat deposits in males are in the lower stomach and back. i won't go into the science of it because there's a good chance you don't give a shit, but the mix of fats in those areas contain a higher ratio of alpha-2 fats that are difficult to mobilize and therefore burn. if you're already reasonably lean (15%bf or less) then you may want to consider doing cardio when fasted and supplementing with a yohimbine hcl/caffeine stack. i'll give more details if that's the case. more than likely though, you just need to lower your bodyfat. count calories and stay at about 2200, though again if you srsly give a shit let me know and we can figure out a more exact kcal requirement.

HEY CHOJIN (serious post coming up, get ready), what's your opinion on BURPEES? I don't have access to any gym equipment currently and I've heard good things

burpees are pretty good for cardio. they're not good for much else. personally i think they're the best pre-workout cardio you can do, provided you can do about 20 of them without wanting to pass out. a good set of burpees will warm up everything, but any pre-workout cardio should be done at medium intensity; so unless you can do burpees all day long, an elliptical will serve you better.

for people who are wondering what a burpee is:
http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/BurpeeAdvanced.gif

i prefer the variation with a chin-up at the top of the jump

Also I still have no idea what the fuck all this jargon is or what any of these numbers mean

"Yeah bro do like 5x27 power cleans that shit is sick"

1x2 means 1 set of 2 reps. A 'set' is one series of lifts and a 'rep' is one complete movement. Most of my numbers are 3x5; on bench press this means i lie down and do 5 presses, then rest, for a total of 3 times.

this is a power clean:
http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/PowerClean.gif

it's an olympic lift, and i wouldn't recommend olympic lifts for anyone who is lifting for only aesthetics.

I basically just want to be more limber and slightly more toned while still being able to smoke. I don't want/need to get BRO big, bro.

this is what literally every single person who ever wants fitness advice says. just an fyi. as terezi2 said, you will not get big unless you eat big and/or take roids.

So I was trying to study the convict conditioning chart above, but some things were too tiny to read. I ended up getting the book and if you look past all the "hey dude, lifting weights is for fags, in prison you gotta be tough" talk, there's really detailed explanations on how to do each exercise and how to get from step 1 to 10 without killing yourself. I'd recommend getting it, even if it's through illegal means. The beginning exercises look easy enough for a novice such as I.

I've never actually read the book, I just have looked at the bodyweight exercises and they're all pretty solid. I also hear it recommended by people I respect. Ty for looking into it and letting me know it's full of toughguy bullshit about weightlifting so I can warn people in the future. The only problem I have with the charts is that they want you to do 20 reps of stuff which is tres silly. 3-5 reps is best for strength and 10-12 is best for size; more than that will help your endurance and tolerance to lactic acid, neither of which are related to aesthetics. maybe if you're doing a sport that requires you to do 50 handstand pushups as part of your competition it would make sense.

[ItalianStereotype]

speaking of cardio, I think it's important to note that all forms of cardio are not equal. well, there's a lot of broscience and speculation, at least.

my two favorite forms of cardio are swimming and HIIT. HIIT is high intensity interval training, which essentially means that throughout your exercise you will have short spurts of the most intense effort you can muster. when jogging, you'll have a two minute stretch at your normal pace, then 30 seconds at a full sprint, returning to the normal pace and continuing to alternate.

[Zomboid]

Yeah, the areas you described are where there are still small deposits. It's weird, because my hip bones stick out, but I have a bit of fat around the back of them. I don't know what my body fat % is at. MAYHAPS CARDIO IS IN ORDER.

[Guitar Woman]

I was just thinking some squats and bench presses were in order, most of the barbell tomfoolery I've seen looks completely batshit. Basically my bro plan looks something like:

Run to the gym or, failing that, run on the treadmill when I get there
3x5 BENCH PRESSES RARRRRRGH
3x5 SQUATS RARRRRGH
3x20 Kneeling push-ups
3x7 Chin-ups, to be increased later when I stop being a puny piece of shit
Swim a few laps or just run back home if I don't mind being a repulsive sweaty shit on the street

I did a sort of prototype version of this today and ran a few miles on the beach, did a shitload of kneeling push-ups, bodyweight squats and chin-ups, then went swimming in the ocean. I have no idea why I didn't just do this years ago, it's easy as shit and I was sweating up a monsoon.

Also, question about chin-ups: Underhand or overhand? Should I just do an even amount of both?

[Chojin]

my two favorite forms of cardio are swimming and HIIT

same here, but I do DDR for HIIT. yes it fucking counts if you do the shit i do.

GW: generally speaking, don't do more than 10 minutes of cardio on lifting days--it will negatively impact your lifts and your body's ability to heal from lifts. your routine also needs more core work, shoulder work and back work other than lats (chins will cover your lats). I recommend deadlifts, standing dumbbell military presses, and cable rows. the bodyweight equivalents would be handstand shoulder presses and inverted rows. you don't have to do all this shit on the same day. beginners should usually pick 3 exercises to do per day. so for you, i'd recommend:

day 1:
3x5 barbell squat (or 3xlots of pistol squats)
3x5 bbell or dbell bench press (or 3xlots of pushups)
3x5 chin up

day 2:
1x5 barbell deadlift (or 3x lots of superman & crunches/situps)
3x5 standing dumbbell military press (or 3x5 handstand pushups)
3x5 cable row (or 3x lots of inverted rows)

exercises in parenthesis are bodyweight equivalents. don't settle for bodyweight shit if you don't have to because you won't get the results you want nearly as fast and you'll plateau early. squat and deadz are the most important lifts which is why i put them first, so if you get too tired to finish the whole thing (pussy) then you at least got the important stuff done.

btw this is my favorite site to pull exercises from, and it helps you to build an understanding of the musculature involved too:
http://www.exrx.net/Lists/Directory.html

for example if you want more ideas for exercises that target the same muscles as cable rows, you could go to 'general back' and then goodness look at all those rows.

[Chojin]

btw my fitocracy name is Payback, my profile is here: http://www.fitocracy.com/profile/payback/

this is one of those "do as i say, not as i do" things--don't copy anyone's routine (esp if they've been lifting for years). what is appropriate and works for them is not necessarily appropriate for you.

that routine i just posted is pretty solid for beginners. you may want to add curls if you're into that sort of thing. i recommend doing some wrist work after a few months (especially pronations and supinations), and that goes double for people who don't use dumbbells much.

[ItalianStereotype]

To expand on Terezi1, you might also try some barbell shrugs to work on your traps and some bent over rows to work on your middle back and shoulders.

You might also consider the clean and jerk if you have any kettlebells around, as that would probably be significantly less stressful than using a barbell and hits so many muscle groups.

[Chojin]

bent over row hits the same targets as cable rows, but cable rows are harder to fuck up and are easier on your spine. considering i advised him to DL on the same day i feel the cable row is a better option.

[ItalianStereotype]

bluh, I never feel satisfied with cable rows

[Chojin]

HOW MUCH FOOD SHOULD YOU EAT?
To lose weight, you need to eat less calories than your body uses every day. This is commonly referred to as "calories in vs. calories out." Calorie-counting websites can help with the "calories in" portion, but you will likely need a different site to track the "calories out" side because estimates of calories expended are usually inflated. "Calories out" refers to three types of calorie use: calories used to continue existing, also called your basal metabolic rate, calories used by your metabolism (which is influenced by exercise), and calories directly burned through exercise.

So to lose weight, your "calories in" need to be less than your "calories out." It really is that simple. The error in this equation invariably comes down to people being terrible at estimating both sides of it. Common thinking is that because a pound of fat is represented by 3500 calories, eating at a 500 calorie deficit every day will result in a 1-pound loss of fat per week (500*7=3500). That's actually a pretty decent deficit for cutting, but for different reasons; weight loss is not necessarily fat loss, but we'll get to that in a minute.

How much fat would you like to lose? Obese people can eat very little and see the greatest fat losses because they're basically food camels. Human survival mechanisms also probably make it the most challenging (mentally) for these people to lose weight, because your body wants to keep eating the same types and the same amounts of food that it's used to. Regardless of your body shape and size, if you're looking to cut weight, you will have to break some habits and make new ones. Set a benchmark: 1/2 lb/week? 1 lb/week? 2 lbs/week? Go ahead and multiply 3500 by that benchmark, then divide it by 7 to reach your daily deficit. For the purposes of this example, we'll shoot for 1 lb/week: 3500 * 1 / 7 = a 500 Calorie daily deficit.

Now we have to find your Calorie requirements. First, we will find your BMR (basal metabolic rate), which is the amount of Calories you burn by existing independent of other factors (such as gravity or doing anything at all, including sitting down). You will multiply your BMR by your activity level to ballpark the effect your metabolism has on your calorie expenditure. Finally, you can then add in the direct effect of any exercise you do--personally, I tend to leave this part out as it's the most inaccurate part of the equation and leaving it out will lower your calorie target anyway and cause you to burn more fat. But I digress.

Click here to calculate BMR and the metabolic effect of activity: http://www.muscleandstrength.com/tools/bmr-and-daily-calorie-calculator.html. I'm 5'7", 179 lbs, age 27, male, I exercise every day. My daily needs are 3189 Calories/day. This calculation uses the basic BMR formula for BMR and the Harris-benedict formula for metabolic estimates.

So my daily requirements are 3189 and my daily deficit is 500. Therefore I should eat 3189-500= 2689 Calories a day to lose about a pound of fat per week.

I'm pretty much CUTTAN FOR LIFE so I tend to eat well below my maintenance calories--about 2000 Calories/day. With the above estimate, I would therefore be losing over 2 lbs of fat per week.

If you're trying to GAIN WEIGHT, you would have a caloric surplus instead of a deficit, which you would add to your requirements instead of subtracting it. If I wanted to GAIN 2 lbs per week, I should therefore eat 3189+1000= 4189 Calories/day.

So the biggest part of not being a fatshit is your eats. I cannot recommend a calorie counting website enough. I use fatsecret because they have an android app that scans food barcodes too. Just because you're trying to lose weight does not mean that you must only eat granola bars and tree bark (in fact, both are generally very bad ideas). Find foods that you like at accessible restaurants and learn the calorie content of various foods. Improve your estimating ability at home by buying a food scale (it doubles as a postal scale, so it's a useful thing to have anyway). Your goal with making your weight loss fat loss is to eat as much protein as possible while limiting sugar and fat (without going into too much detail, sugar is processed differently from other carbs and it's easier for it to be converted to body fat; dietary fat actually isn't necessarily bad at all, but it's very calorie-dense so if you avoid it you can eat more things within your limit, which will help satiety).

Here are some samples from my own eats this week:

Wednesday:
http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/fit/food-110706.gif

19% fat
38% carb
43% protein

Friday:
http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/fit/food-110708.gif

17% fat
46% carb
37% protein

Set up 'meals' inside your calorie program to make this go faster. Most of these entries are presets for me. As you can see, eating at Subway suddenly becomes awesome when you get one of their low-fat subs and then add double meat instead of getting a footlong: it costs the same and you're getting all the meat of a footlong with only half the bread. Both days I ate baked chicken breast sandwiches with pasta sauce and cheese. Pretty much anything involving chicken breast is great. Notice also that about 80% of my daily sugar intake is from Gatorade, which is consumed while I'm working out and therefore immediately burning the sugar for energy.

[Pram Maven]

I have never been overweight, not that I'm bashing anyone who has been. You do what you want with your life, it's yours and no one else's. The reason I'm not fat is I walk two miles to work, lift heavy shit for 10 hours and then walk home.

If you want to lose weight and keep it off, there are three things I can think of that will do the trick, but you have to stick to a regimen and never vary from it.

1. Swim. You use your whole body just to tread water. Imagine what 100 laps doing the crawl stroke does for you.
2. Ride a bicycle. Cycling is great excercise and it's kind of fun.
3. Jump in place. It's like climbing a long flight of stairs. You will get winded fast, but if you do it every day you will be able to do it more often and for longer periods of time.

As far as food; broccoli, boneless chicken breast, and fruit. Eat four small meals, two to three hours apart instead of one big one. That will train your metabolic cycle to burn food regularly instead of trying to attack a huge amount in a short time, which overwhelms it.

I used to be able to eat whatever I wanted and not gain anything, but now that I'm older I can't do that anymore. What's kept me thin is just briskly walking everywhere, running around at work to get everything done, and eating little often.

This is not intended to be exhaustive or a replacement for Chojin's advice. I think he has the right idea and it's clearly worked for him (sorry for making fun of your weight lifting video, Choj).

[Pram Maven]

Well, it looked like he was hurting himself. All I did was suggest that he might not being doing it right out of concern for his back.

Anyway, i-mockery, Kahl. What have I done here but insult every time I saw an angle? I'm tiring of being a one-dimensional hate rake, though. There's plenty of good stuff here. The video game threads take me back since a lot of us are around the same age, and there are many talented people posting in the Art Shit. I'd rather find something in common with other posters than fight all the time.

[Chojin]

Eat four small meals, two to three hours apart instead of one big one. That will train your metabolic cycle to burn food regularly instead of trying to attack a huge amount in a short time, which overwhelms it.

I'm glad someone brought this up because it's a common misconception. Would humanity have ever survived if we got 'overwhelmed' from a large meal when the typical eating patterns of our ancestors involved periods of feast and famine? Different macronutrients "burn" at different rates, with proteins taking hours upon hours to digest. This also debunks the conception that your body can only "handle" a certain amount of protein in one meal.

Source: http://www.bodyrecomposition.com/research-review/meal-frequency-and-energy-balance-research-review.html#more-1389

Also, the video of me deadlifting is not meant to be taken seriously and it certainly isn't meant to be taken as a primer on DL form. That said, it's pretty much impossible to tell from a frontal angle whether someone's deadlifting incorrectly.

[ItalianStereotype]

okay everybody, ignore the entire rest of the thread and take granny walks at the mall with pram maven. you will not be fat internet virgins anymore after that.

[Pram Maven]

Chojin makes some good points about metabolism and deadlifting. I didn't see him bending his knees in the video, but if he was being serious about it I'm sure he would have done it correctly.

As far as digestion goes, it's important to consider that prehistoric man did not consume cheese or milk. Our intestinal tracts were not designed for dairy at all. It's remarkable how much needs to be done to cow's milk in order to make it palatable to humans.

I tried to make that point earlier, but was banned for... circumventing Kahljorn's ban...somehow.

[Chojin]

uh, prehistoric man most definitely did consume milk. how do you think infants were fed?

i wasn't recommending some retarded paleo diet, i was just appealing to common sense based on our ancestry--if humans experienced negative athletic performance or "energy issues" from fasting, we wouldn't be here today. this is also a central tenet of the intermittent fasting movement (leangains.com).

[Pram Maven]

Hmmmm...Sorry, I should have clarified. Prehistoric humans did not suck on their mothers' teats to get milk beyond infancy.

As far as energy issues, I have yet to find a way to not crash shortly after eating. Also can't eat cereal with milk in it. That does the biggest number on my energy levels. Do you have any idea what is going on there? For some reason it just makes feel really...low. Hypoglycemia runs in the family, but I never thought milk affected blood sugar levels. The funny thing is, I used to eat sugar like there was no tomorrow and it had no effect. Sooner or later I'd just crash, but it didn't make me feel ill like this.

[Chojin]

you're probably lactose intolerant

if it happens with other types of foods, try making starches and proteins a bigger % of your diet, as those macros are metabolized more slowly. if you're still having issues, try cutting out carbs completely and see how you feel. also cut out caffeine if you haven't already.

[Pentegarn]

As far as energy issues, I have yet to find a way to not crash shortly after eating. Also can't eat cereal with milk in it. That does the biggest number on my energy levels.

Could you be lactose intolerant in a minor way? I have heard stories of people who had a mild version of lactose intolerance where they either have mild stomach issues or lethargy after consuming dairy products. The good news is that if this is the case there are different medications that can combat it

EDIT: NInja'd by Chojin and a lack of brevity on my part :lol

[Pram Maven]

Haha, both replies are useful, thanks.

I don't know if I'm mildly anything, Pent. Is that even possible? According to credible sources (I-mockery), I'm such an extreme racist, sexist, child-molesting pig that mild lactose intolerance doesn't really fit my M.O.
Extreme lactose intolerance, on the other hand... That would work. I need to throw up more often, thrash around, and change colors. Medications, I'm not too thrilled about. The last two times I needed anything like that was for pneumonia last Winter (cranberry juice somehow found its way into my lungs) and Abilify last Spring for anxiety. Didn't take it with anything but I still didn't like it...The main cause of the anxiety in the first place was excessive caffeine, which I cut back on and that did wonders except for withdrawl headaches.

Chojin- I know what calories are, but carbohydrates are not something I've ever fully understood. Does that have anything to do with starch? I know sugar and starch are related, that's why I ask. Protein, I think, I've got covered with meat and eggs. Despite eating small meals, it's been largely microwaveable pizzas and burritos. I may be skinny, but that does not necessarily mean I eat right. Something to work on, but healthy food is so expensive.

[k0k0]

Since I'm working out of the house most of the time I don't get a lot of sun causing me to have a vitamin D deficiency. Will that in any way fuck up my chances of getting stronger/losing some weight? I know it means I'll have less energy, but is vitamin D necessary for me other than that? I have started taking vitamin d supplements and trying to get more sun on my breaks.

[Chojin]

Chojin- I know what calories are, but carbohydrates are not something I've ever fully understood. Does that have anything to do with starch? I know sugar and starch are related, that's why I ask. Protein, I think, I've got covered with meat and eggs. Despite eating small meals, it's been largely microwaveable pizzas and burritos. I may be skinny, but that does not necessarily mean I eat right. Something to work on, but healthy food is so expensive.

Carbohydrates come in starch, sugar, and fiber. On a nutritional label, deduct fiber and sugar from the total carb amount and you have the amount of starch. Count your calories with a calorie tracker to find out what your daily ratios are. Most people don't get enough protein and get too much sugar.

Healthy food isn't expensive, you're just not used to buying and preparing it (you also probably have no concept of what makes a food "healthy", like most people; people seem to associate organics and expensive variations on produce with health, which isn't the case). I'll submit that it's inconvenient to eat lean, but it's even less convenient to have a variety of physical and mental disorders. You seem to have enough free time, so no excuses.

Since I'm working out of the house most of the time I don't get a lot of sun causing me to have a vitamin D deficiency. Will that in any way fuck up my chances of getting stronger/losing some weight? I know it means I'll have less energy, but is vitamin D necessary for me other than that? I have started taking vitamin d supplements and trying to get more sun on my breaks.

Vitamin D supports mental health, helps to regulate blood pressure, and has a variety of other benefits. It's about $10 for an 8 month supply (link (http://www.amazon.com/gp/offer-listing/B0032BH76O/ref=sr_1_1_olp?ie=UTF8&qid=1310388929&sr=8-1&condition=new)). It won't kill you to not take it, but it's a good idea to make it happen. Fish oil is more important than D, especially if your goal is fat loss. An effective dose of fish oil is about 5g total (ratio of EPA/DHA assumed normal), and an effective dose of D in the summer is 5,000 IU. These are both well above the recommended doses of both, but the "normal" amount borders on homeopathic dosages. Fish oil capsules generally contain 1g of oil each, so it's more convenient to supplement it in liquid form (link (http://www.amazon.com/Carlson-Finest-Liquid-Omega-3-Lemon/dp/B001LF39RO/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1310389119&sr=8-1)). Vitamin D you can get in small 5,000 IU capsules, as linked above.

[Pram Maven]

Okay, okay. I'll dig out the diet recommendations the doctor gave me.

Here's something interesting... There is a fatty deposit in the underside my left wrist that has been there since 2002 (possibly a ganglion cyst). It's not hard, and it only shows when I flex it. If that resulted from having a poor diet, then I better eat better fast.

Another thing... I have iron-deficient anemia. I wonder if that's connected to my mood instability. I had no idea that was even related to Vitamin D (which is found in sunlight. Which I haven't gotten much of since I started working at night 9 years ago, when I started becoming aggressive and forgetful.

Could it be that... All of these things are connected and simply not getting enough sunlight on top of working at night is affecting me mentally and physically?

[ItalianStereotype]

koko, a lack of vitamin D, as terezi1 said, affects mental health. I feel it's important to note that it can cause MAJOR depression. some are hypothesizing that many suicide cases can be attributed to depression caused by a lack of vitamin D and niacin. Aside from that, depression can affect fat loss as you may come to eat and eat and eat in order to feel good and never move around much.

pram, same thing for you. much of what you describe as your mental issues might come from a lack of essential nutrients. you may consider supplementation as a good way to start, but again, as terezi1 has said, you need to critically adjust your diet. immediate supplementation, however, may make you feel significantly better in the short term.

[Pram Maven]

Thanks, ItalianStereotype.

I don't know where it comes from, I just know that it's always been the worst when I was sitting at a computer. I also don't take enough breaks and have to close one eye because it goes out of focus after a few hours. Thinking about getting an eye patch for when that happens.

[Dixie]

Chojin, I like this thread. Thank you for making it. i think the convict type workout will work best for me considering the confined space i'm in at the moment. I shall give it a try!

[Tadao]

Can I help oil you up?

[Fathom Zero]

She needs help with the belt first.

Hdl66zYtPEA

[Dixie]

do you guys hear a buzzing sound?
anyways, soon-to-be-mr.dixie oils me up with coconut oil after showers.
the ben wa balls are a good warm up.

[Dixie]

for serious though, i don't even have space for my bellydancing in here.

[Kitsa]

Chojin, I found a healthy dish (http://antiguadailyphoto.com/2010/08/16/guatemalan-cuisine-chojin/)with your name all over it.

[Chojin]

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/amazing.gif

[Dixie]

that really does look awesome

[Guitar Woman]

Kay, I went to the gym today and did that shit I said I was going to do. Now I have a question.

Should I be alternating exercises between sets (i.e. after doing one set of presses, I move on to squats, then chin-ups, then push-ups, then rest and go back to the beginning) or is it better to tackle all 3 sets of one before doing something else? This is probably a retarded question.

I had to fumble around a bit before I found the right weights, but I think 40 pounds for bench presses and 60 for squats worked all right. I did an extra set of both of them to compensate for the ones I did with less weight.

NEW BRO PLAN:
Day 1 (Saturday, non-gym day because I wake up at like 4 PM on the weekend and the gym is going to be fucking packed anyway):
3x20 Kneeling Push-Ups
3x10 Standing Dumbbell Military Presses (20 pounds)
3x10 Dumbbell Squats (20 pounds)
Probably some running at some point

Day 2 (Monday, what I did today):
4 mins cardio (running, not jogging or walking like a faggot, full on Doctor Who mode)
3x5 Bench Presses (40 pounds)
3x5 Barbell Squats (60 pounds)
3x5 Underhand Chin-Ups
3x15 Kneeling Push-Ups
4 mins cardio

Day 3 (Wednesday):
4 mins cardio
1x5 Barbell Deadlifts (IDK what the fuck weight I should use, I was going to fool around with these at the gym today but it was crowded and I didn't want to break anyone's foot by dropping weights on them)
3x10 Standing Dumbbell Military Presses (20 pounds)
3x5 Cable Rows / 3x15 Inverted Rows (I'll decide which one I like better when I try them out, then stick to one)
3x5 Underhand Chin-Ups
4 mins cardio

I've done all of these except deadlifts and rows, I think they're all right. I want a fourth exercise to do on Saturday, but I can't think of one if crunches/sit-ups are for fags.

[ItalianStereotype]

You could probably drop those kneeling pushups. I'm not overly fond of the split you chose, how comfortable are you with your routine?

I tend to do all three sets before moving on to the next exercise. I finish one set, thirty second rest, next set, thirty second rest, final set. There's no such thing as a retarded question unless you yourself are retarded.

Have you made any changes to your diet?

[Guitar Woman]

Pretty comfortable. What really kills me is the running since my lungs are still full of tumors and shit, but it'll probably get better the more I do it. When everything else starts getting easier I'm thinking I'll just do all of my Monday/Wednesday exercises on the same day, and do that twice a week.

Have you made any changes to your diet?
Not really, no

The reason I got flabby was because I ate McDonald's for lunch every day for two months, then woke up one day and was like "holy shit I got fucking fat." I don't do that anymore, but I could probably stand to eat fewer chips. My favorite snack food at the moment is almonds, which apparently have a shitload of fat in them, but they're the only source of fiber I can find that won't solidify into unpassable chunks of lead in my intestines. They're not going anywhere.

[ItalianStereotype]

You're going to be consistently disappointed with your progress in the gym if you don't change your diet. Do you at least have any consistency in what you eat?

Also, fat isn't necessarily bad. when people think of fat in a negative connotation, they're often really thinking about LDL cholesterol. almonds are good. eat them and love them.

[Guitar Woman]

Yes, I eat the same things every week more or less. Lots and lots of fruit (apples and bananas, less grapefruit than I would like), chicken and turkey whenever it's there (I fucking love turkey clubs), saltine crackers, ice cream (I know it's shit for me), oatmeal, and for lunch I usually just have baked potato chips. Maybe a few slices of pizza on saturday.

If I can bring myself to get rid of the pizza, ice cream, and chips I think I'll be all right, but I'd have to make time for accomodating some sort of crazy tibetan mummification diet.

Edit, mostly so I can remember wtf later
My meals run something like:
Breakfast:
Nothing

"Lunch":
A bowl or two of almonds spaced from 10 AM to 4 PM
A few apples and bananas
A mug of kratom tea

Dinner:
Whatever's there, usually chicken or a few more apples

On lifting days I get a 5-dollar turkey, lettuce, and tomato sandwich on whole wheat about 15 minutes after I finish working out, which is usually around 5:30 PM, so that's my dinner on those days. I put three packets of mayo and mustard on it because it's a big fucking sandwich and because whole wheat tastes like shit dry, sue me.

I drink water constantly, and I've stopped drinking alcohol altogether because A, I hate it, and B, you guys said not to. I also stopped getting stoned every day so that I wouldn't spend my evenings going on uncontrollable junk food binges. Starting yesterday I'm swearing off ice cream and the free bags of chips at the office, but I might keep pizza night on Saturday going.

This list made me realize that I eat basically jack shit. I'm not sure if I should be worried about this.

[k0k0]

I'm losing about half a pound a day lately since I switched to eating only 1500 calories each day. I exercise about an hour a day, doing 30 minutes of cardio on my elliptical and then the convict conditioning stuff. I know they say you're not supposed to do cardio on days when you do strength training, but I feel it can only help my endurance.

[ItalianStereotype]

I've never been a big believer that cardio is bad for your gains. A little cardio warm up and cool down is perfectly alright.

[ItalianStereotype]

I should say you probably don't want to run five miles and then lift

[ItalianStereotype]

Yes, I eat the same things every week more or less. Lots and lots of fruit (apples and bananas, less grapefruit than I would like), chicken and turkey whenever it's there (I fucking love turkey clubs), saltine crackers, ice cream (I know it's shit for me), oatmeal, and for lunch I usually just have baked potato chips. Maybe a few slices of pizza on saturday.

If I can bring myself to get rid of the pizza, ice cream, and chips I think I'll be all right, but I'd have to make time for accomodating some sort of crazy tibetan mummification diet.

You should set up a meal plan. A legitimate meal plan. None of this "when it's there" shit.

[ItalianStereotype]

For example, here's what I had on my last bench day:

Breakfast
4 eggs
1 cup steel cut oats
1 cup raspberries
1 glass milk
Water

Snack
1 tomato, sliced and drizzled with olive oil
Water

Lunch
Turkey sandwich on whole grain bread, dry
1 slice of fresh, whole milk mozzarella
3/4 cup of brown rice
Raw baby spinach
Water

Snack
3 oranges because they are my weakness
Green tea

Dinner
Grilled chicken
1 sliced tomato
Raw baby spinach
1/2 cup brown rice
Milk
Water

Post workout
BROTEINZ

Before bed
Cottage cheese

[Chojin]

i don't think a meal plan is necessary, provided that you eat the protein and starches your body needs in proximity to workouts, and provided your daily calories and macro ratios are in check. then again i'm tremendously used to doing that, so maybe planning it would be easier for a nub.

NEW BRO PLAN:
Day 1 (Saturday, non-gym day because I wake up at like 4 PM on the weekend and the gym is going to be fucking packed anyway):
3x20 Kneeling Push-Ups
3x10 Standing Dumbbell Military Presses (20 pounds)
3x10 Dumbbell Squats (20 pounds)
Probably some running at some point

Day 2 (Monday, what I did today):
4 mins cardio (running, not jogging or walking like a faggot, full on Doctor Who mode)
3x5 Bench Presses (40 pounds)
3x5 Barbell Squats (60 pounds)
3x5 Underhand Chin-Ups
3x15 Kneeling Push-Ups
4 mins cardio

Day 3 (Wednesday):
4 mins cardio
1x5 Barbell Deadlifts (IDK what the fuck weight I should use, I was going to fool around with these at the gym today but it was crowded and I didn't want to break anyone's foot by dropping weights on them)
3x10 Standing Dumbbell Military Presses (20 pounds)
3x5 Cable Rows / 3x15 Inverted Rows (I'll decide which one I like better when I try them out, then stick to one)
3x5 Underhand Chin-Ups
4 mins cardio

disjointed notes on all of that:

stuff like kneeling pushups and inverted rows are replacements for weighted exercises and which you can do at home. i wouldn't ever do those at a gym. i wouldn't bother with dumbbell squats because you'll outgrow them (your ability to grip the dumbbells will fail way before your ability to squat at high weights with dbs) and then you'll have to learn how to do real squats anyway, or if you plan to never do a barbell squat you could just use the leg press machine with similar effects.

the only leg work you have are squats. stuff you're missing in your routine: hamstrings, calves, arms, traps, posterior deltoid (back of shoulder), lateral deltoid (top of shoulder), upper pecs, pec minors, abs, lower abs/hip flexors. that's probably not a problem for a beginner's routine, but if you're going to do a limited beginner's routine you might as well just do Starting Strength. starting strength is just A: squat, bench, chinups; B: squat, overhead press, deadlift. get the program with the DVD from the pirate bay or buy it and learn your form.

for a deadlift to be at the proper height, you either need to use at least one 45-lb plate on each side, or you need to balance the bar on a pair of very low safety rails (this is called a rack pull). the minimum weight on a normal deadlift is therefore 135 lbs (45 + 45 + 45 for the bar).

if you can't do dragon flags, decline weighted situps are good. they work best with a medicine ball and a partner, but you can just as easily hold onto a plate while doing it.

your pre-workout cardio should be done at medium to low intensity, or it will negatively impact your ability to lift. do not sprint to prepare for liftan. the purpose of pre-workout cardio is to move blood to your muscles to prevent injury. the way you can tell when you've done enough is when you feel warm and are sweating. at medium intensity, this usually takes about 7 minutes for me. there is no need to do cardio after your lifts. there is also no need to stretch if you use warm-up sets (you should use warm-up sets). warm-up sets act as functional dynamic stretches. static stretching (holding a pose) has never been proven in a study to reduce injury, and has in fact been proven to increase the likelihood of injury if a stretch is maintained for more than 10 seconds.

[Babs]

So over a couple of weeks, I've managed to lose 13 pounds of fat! Not to bad so far.

[Zhukov]

For example, here's what I had on my last bench day:

Breakfast
4 eggs
1 cup steel cut oats
1 cup raspberries
1 glass milk
Water

Snack
1 tomato, scliced and drizzled with olive oil
Water

and the rest etc etc...


That sounds like starvation rations, even though it isn't. :\

[Shrubfest]

Slightly off track, but how would you work a diet plan for two people's meals?

Just cook a batch, then regulate through portions?

With me being a 5'4" woman and him being a 6'4" man food rations are problematic.

[ItalianStereotype]

I will say, I do not follow any set meal plan. I don't need it. A meal plan should be about instilling discipline so that you don't eat the next piece of cake you see and touch your dick at the same time. Eating poorly kills progress.

There's nothing wrong with doing cardio after a workout, if you WANT to do cardio. I, however, rarely focus on cardio at all. Generally twice a week. My warmups consist of muscle ups, burpees, lunges, good mornings, and the like. I do, however, always stretch after my workout. Picked it up after my car accident.

SS is probably the best way to go, but if you're too lazy to do what Chojin says, go here (http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=998224).

[ItalianStereotype]

Slightly off track, but how would you work a diet plan for two people's meals?

Just cook a batch, then regulate through portions?

With me being a 5'4" woman and him being a 6'4" man food rations are problematic.

You being a 5'4" woman and your significant other being a 6'4" man must make for clown sex.

Your dietary needs will be significantly different. He will likely need A LOT more than you on any given day. Get a feel for your portion sizes, yes, but also think about what each of you really needs throughout the day. Are you physically active? What do you eat?

[Shrubfest]

We're only mildly active. I tend to like a lot of salad and vegetables, he's a protein fiend but also a grease junkie. He insists baked beans are a good source of nutrients and protein and incorporates them into as many meals as possible.

[Tadao]

Speaking of fitness, I would like to fit my dick between your tits.

[Zhukov]

Here's what I had today

BREAKFAST
Crumpets drizzled with peanut butter (4)
Cup of luke warm, slightly coffee flavoured milk

SNACK
Jam and peanut butter sandwiches (3-4)
Biscuits (lots)
Apple
Packet of chips with tomato sauce
Water

LUNCH
Penang chicken curry and stir fry rice
Iced tea

SNACK
Mars Bar

DINNER
Plate of spaghetti
Homemade scotch eggs in wallaby mince (6)
Water
Cup of tea

SNACK
Water
Peanuts

DESSERT
Ice cream
A quarter of a chocolate pie

SNACK
More ice cream and pie

I generally don't stick to any kind of plan, I don't need it probably and also can't be bothered, and often I will drop breakfast if I wake up after 1:00pm, in favour of extra snacking at regular intervals. Dessert is subject to availability, and may just involve several cups of tea with lots of biscuits.

Exercise usually consists of watching JAG, MacGyver and Sabrina the Teenage Witch on midday television, and then walking down shops when I get hungry. Today, however, I danced my tits off to music for several hours.

[ItalianStereotype]

We're only mildly active. I tend to like a lot of salad and vegetables, he's a protein fiend but also a grease junkie. He insists baked beans are a good source of nutrients and protein and incorporates them into as many meals as possible.

Do you intend to become more active?

[Shrubfest]

I do, yes. And he'll take up weights again 'as soon as I get my gym up'.

The other thing being that he wants to weight lift, meaning he wants nothing but protein, whereas I want both cardio and weights (being a fatty girl and all)

[ItalianStereotype]

For the most part you should be consuming 1 to 1.5 grams of protein per pound of body weight, take that into consideration before you start doing meat on meat sandwiches with meatshakes for every meal. Also consider whether or not you plan on supplementing before or after a workout.

This is a really good place to start if you want some general information. (http://www.liamrosen.com/fitness.html) I don't mind helping you form up a dietary plan or an exercise regimen and I'm sure the first Terezi wouldn't either.

[ItalianStereotype]

Here's what I had today

Oh shit brah are you BULKAN

[Zhukov]

I'm a lean, lean, leaning machine.

[Chojin]

your husband will need to do cardio as well. unless he has some amazing genetics, his blood pressure and cholesterol levels will be fuct without cardio.

i watched an interesting film the other day called 'fat head' that had some odd ideas about the role of cholesterol in heart health (namely, that cholesterol levels are irrelevant). it also said some things about dieting that bordered on misinformation, but i won't bother to go into it unless anyone else has seen the film and wants to talk about it. i'm adjusting my macros to 40% fat (mostly saturated animal fat) / 40% protein / 20% carb (mostly low GI) to test out the concepts it raised that i'm unfamiliar with, since I've been eating very low fat for quite some time and my bloodwork came back terrible.

[GOOGLE POLICE]

CHOJIN YOU FORGOT TO MENTION ABOUT "REFEEDING SYNDROME"<----THIS IS A LINK (http://www.google.com/#hl=en&cp=5&gs_id=i&xhr=t&q=refeeding+syndrome&pf=p&sclient=psy&site=&source=hp&pbx=1&oq=refee&aq=0&aqi=g2g-s2g1&aql=&gs_sm=&gs_upl=&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=cae8a5964b14564c&biw=1147&bih=625),

WE JUST GOT A CALL AT THE STATION THAT YOU KILLED DON CARLSON DUE TO YOUR CRIMINAL NEGLIGENCE REGARDING THE BAD INFORMATION YOU TOLD HIM. HE HADN'T EATEN IN TWO WEEKS BECAUSE OF THE STRESS YOU PUT HIM THROUGH, ACCORDING TO HIS LOCKET DIARY, AND THIS MORNING HE APPARENTLY ATE TWO SUB SANDWICHES AND A LARGE DIET CAKE. HE WAS PRONOUNCED ALIVE AT THE SCENE, BUT WAS LATER UPGRADED TO DEAD DUE TO HIS LACK OF A DISCERNABLE HEARTBEAT.

I'M AFRAID YOU'LL HAVE TO COME WITH US, SON.

[Chojin]

Refeeding syndrome occurs when previously malnourished patients are fed with high carbohydrate loads, the result is a rapid fall in phosphate, magnesium and potassium, along with an increasing ECF volume, leading to a variety of complications.

this is actually kinda interesting, and i've never heard of it. it explains why lyle's ultimate diet 2.0 recommends magnesium and potassium supplements before the carb refeed on the weekend.

[GOOGLE POLICE]

I DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT EITHER UNTIL I SAW IT ON 1000 WAYS TO DIE.

SOURCE: (http://www.spike.com/video-clips/epq06z/1000-ways-to-die-skinny-boned) <--- THIS IS ALSO A LINK THAT YOU CAN CLICK ON PRETTY COOL

[Pentegarn]

So is this just gonna be your new identity Pram?

[creeposaurus]

I DIDN'T KNOW ABOUT IT EITHER UNTIL I SAW IT ON 1000 WAYS TO DIE.

SOURCE: (http://www.spike.com/video-clips/epq06z/1000-ways-to-die-skinny-boned) <--- THIS IS ALSO A LINK THAT YOU CAN CLICK ON PRETTY COOL

Stay in character, people like you better that way.


Are there certain foods that help boost metabolism?

[k0k0]

What I'm wondering is, I've tried to stick to "wholesome" foods for the last week like a lot of places say, but goddamnit I can't get over 600 calories a day doing that. I am sure my body has gone into starvation mode now because I'm stuck at about 205 and not moving anywhere. Should I be sticking to just wholesome foods? I can't eat a whole lot in order to get over 1500 doing it.

[Chojin]

define what the fuck you mean by "wholesome foods" because every fattie in the history of fatness will claim they they "eat right" and "don't eat much at all". I've also heard stories of people feeling certain cookies were health foods because they contained cinnamon, which theoretically has antioxidants.

also "starvation mode" isn't real either.

---

actually i'll just go ahead and give you my response instead of pretending yours will change my answer:

there are no such thing as "health foods". there are foods that come from different (oft unprovable) sources that 99% of the time your body cannot distinguish between other types of food, and there are foods that contain certain proportions of macronutrients. eating organic or vegan will not make you healthy or lean (in fact, vegan diets are fucking awful for losing weight that isn't muscle mass), macronutrients are just a term for fats/carbs/proteins/alcohols.

if you're fat, you need to eat below maintenance calories to lose weight. you should also eat above a certain level if you aren't on awesome drugs (get some awesome drugs btw, i recommend the e/c stack here (http://hotnfit.com/ecstack.htm)), and you should do this not because your body will go into STARVATION MODE and keep your fat around for safekeeping because that doesn't happen and you aren't a fucking hibernating bear, but you should eat at least a little in order to keep yourself from getting the fat munchies later on down the road and consuming the dairy queen and king and their peasantry.

getting back to the discussion of macros: your body doesn't need carbs to survive. you can discard them. your body only needs essential fatty acids and protein; the former you can get in a surplus from 40 calories of fish oil a day--discard the rest. this leaves protein, which is both tremendously filling (moreso than carbs or fats) and is actually useful to your body in terms of maintaining musculature in times of caloric deficit. if you really do throw out all your fats and carbs btw you will also need to supplement magnesium, calcium, and potassium that you would otherwise get from whole food sources. you're 200 lbs so i don't think a crash diet like that is necessary.

if your weight goals are stalling, first make sure you're actually eating at a deficit by counting your calories. fatties pretty much universally lowball their intakes and highball their exercise deficits ("hardgainers" do the opposite), so don't cheat, either. then, check your macros. if you're trying to lose max weight, you can go for a 1% fat 0% carb 99% protein split, which would leave you at about 800 Calories/day (this is prty much how i lost most of my weight in a few months). if you would like to be less insane about it, do something like a 20% 20% 60% split. right now i'm doing a 40% fat 20% carb 40% protein split and i'm still losing fat while currently at about 13% bodyfat and 175 lbs. your protein should be constant regardless of the split (~200g/~800kcal), so anything else you add will negatively contribute to your weight loss until you get lean, at which point you can start being me and worry about insulin levels.

[k0k0]

By "wholesome foods" I mean foods that are processed/refined as little as possible. Like beans, rice, veggies, fruits, chicken without seasoning...

I've been pretty much rounding up on any calorie counts and using measuring cups for my food and putting those into caloriecount.about.com to keep track of my daily calories. Like today I only ate about 800 calories which is probably around 750 really, due to me rounding up my counts to the nearest hundred.

Could it be that I'm losing fat, but since I'm working out for about an hour a day (30 mins cardio, 30 mins strength), I'm also gaining muscle at the same time which is cancelling out my weight loss? Only reason I didn't think this was possible is because I'm always told you can't lose weight and gain muscle at the same time.

[Chojin]

If you're new to anaerobic exercise, you will make strength (and muscle) gains pretty much regardless of caloric intake. That said, water also influences weight--the more starches and sodium you eat, the more water your body will retain and cause your scale weight to increase. Do not confuse scale weight for fat weight. Medications and supplements can also fuck with your water levels. It isn't really a problem unless you rely 100% on a scale and/or electric impedance bodyfat sensors to track your weight loss (impedance sensors actually check water levels to determine fat percentage, which is why every study that uses them isn't credible).

Really, the best indicator of weight loss is comparing photographs and clothing fit/belt sizes. If you really want to get quantitative measure of your fatness, get caliper'd by a personal trainer. Scale weight means fuck all if you aren't obese, doubly so for women since their water weight fluctuates like crazy on a monthly cycle.

In brief, you can definitely gain strength and lose fat at the same time. I've been cutting nonstop and my lifts are all in the "advanced" range.

[k0k0]

Gotcha. I've been using a scale for weight, so I guess I've been doing it wrong. Thanks again.

[Chojin]

yw. Scales aren't the devil, but they're just one metric and often a misleading one. If you're trying to make a certain weight class for competitive sports, it can be an important metric. I admit to being overly concerned with scale weight loss myself.

[captain516]

Bump with question
Want aesthetics
Do I still start off with SS

[Chojin]

Yes, but add some arm work and do chinups more often. Also GOMAD (gallon of milk a day) is a bad idea unless you're looking to compete against mark henry.

http://wrestler.elf24.de/web4/wrestler/html_images/markhenry.jpg

[MLE]

Sombody's gonna get their ass kicked.

[k0k0]

Thanks to Chojin's advice, I did lose 20 pounds. I'm sitting at 194 where I used to be 214. I've never been overweight, but 214 was bordering up there.

[Sam]

Sombody's gonna get their ass kicked.

SOMEBODY GONNA GET THEY WIG SPLIT.

[Pentegarn]

Somebody is about to get inducted into the Hall of Pain

[Kitsa]

http://www.cnn.com/2011/10/14/health/video-gamers-bodybuilders-fitocracy/index.html?hpt=hp_abar

[Chojin]

http://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/exercise.png

my mom sent me that article too. I'm going to source it in my business plan for the fitness racing game i'm working on.

[10,000 Volt Ghost]

I put all my stats into Dexterity, Charisma and Luck though.

[Evil Robot II]

You can buy points from chinese gold farmers.

[Evil Robot II]

or get those disgusting plastic fake muscle implants that are going to cause intense pain when your in your 80's

[Evil Robot II]

Or you can buy a gun to show people whats what.

[Rongi]

CHOJIN

hi

so when i've basically been fat or chubby my entire life. i like food, it's my thing

but when i was 16 i was kind of tired of looking like a shlub all the time. i had a crush on this tennis player girl and i knew that i had no chance in my current physical shape. also i was really depressed because my dad died that year. i started running and biking every day and i basically ate nothing (one day i just ate a muffin in the morning and nothing else the rest of the day) i drank a lot of water too, idk if that helped. I went from 210 to 150 in like...uh, a few months. i stayed around that weight my senior year of hs and then i went to college and kind of gained most of it back

then i lost weight again and whoops i'm back to being kind of fat

HERES THE THING THOUGH

literally every time i got laid it was when i wasn't working out anymore (ok that's not entirely true, i got laid like once when i was in healthy mode a year ago). i'm not even talking about going after fatties, i'm a man with some pretty strict standards about who i will fornicate with.

what i'm basically asking is how do i motivate myself to eat right and conform to a plan of working out? every time i've done it was for dumb reasons (to get girls). i feel like i'll never really do this being healthy thing correctly unless i have the correct frame of mind

[Rongi]

AND BEFORE YOU ANSWER ABOUT HOW I DIDNT HAVE A GOOD PLAN

i actually was on a bunch of those calories tracking websites and i had a weight lifting routine a few months ago. THE SAME ONE AS YOURS :O (the beginner one i mean)

but after doing it for a few months i was like "hey this sucks" and i stopped doing it

[ItalianStereotype]

you really have to have your own motivation. I lift because I like being strong and I enjoy seeing my body in the mirror every day. I lift because I try to better myself physically, emotionally, and intellectually. it's not hard for me to look at shitty food and say no. you're completely in control of yourself and your habits. the sooner you realize that you don't need an external catalyst to motivate you, the better off you'll be.

if you keep yourself motivated long enough to start seeing some results, then you can let that feeling ride and keep yourself going. does it feel good to be fat, or even chubby? do you feel good after eating like shit every day? a year from now, do you want to look back at what you've accomplished and be proud?

[Rongi]

i mean i liked how i looked when i was thinner, it felt nice to be able to put on size 31 and size small shirts

but at the same time i just felt kind of dumb lifting weights. not dumb, mainly bored and like i had to force myself to do it. i feel like i would feel differently if i did it because i was playing sports or doing karate. because at least in that circumstance i would have a reason to want to be healthy, so i can beat people up better

[Rongi]

that should have said size 31 jeans

chojin give me back my edit button already you dildo

[ItalianStereotype]

so why don't you try getting into martial arts or something? get around like minded people.

[Rongi]

I've considered it! Idk how much it costs to get lessons, or what if there is some kind of prerequisite to joining (like you have to already be physically fit or something)

I don't think I'll have time to start taking lessons for a while, though. But it's something I've thought about

[ItalianStereotype]

aren't you in school?

[Rongi]

Uh, yeah. Our school does have a karate/tae kwon do class (one of our degree requirements is to take a fitness course). It usually fills up tho

[ItalianStereotype]

your school doesn't have extracurricular clubs? At my school, I can't walk the halls without seeing advertisements everywhere for karate, hapkido, aikido, taekwando, krav maga, and capoeira clubs.

[Esuohlim]

Dude, I hate exercising and weight-lifting so much. Last summer I did the Couch-to-5k plan for like three straight months and there wasn't a day I did it where I felt good afterwards. I don't understand the whole feeling awesome after working out thing because I've never felt it. Exercising sucks.

Fuck the exercise part, just do the healthy eating part. That's way easier. You'll look like a beanpole faggy hipster but who gives a shit.

Also, the consequence of becoming obsessed with fitness is that you'll end up like Chojin, whose head probably exploded just by reading the opinions in this post.

[Rongi]

your school doesn't have extracurricular clubs? At my school, I can't walk the halls without seeing advertisements everywhere for karate, hapkido, aikido, taekwando, krav maga, and capoeira clubs.

oh dude they probably have a bazillion clubs like that at my school, but my course lode/social life doesn't really give me much time during the semester. i probably won't have proper time to learn a martial art until the summer

[Chojin]

You have to change the way you think about food. Asking how to stick to a diet is the wrong question, because you're already setting it up to be something temporary. The real answer is that you need to learn how to eat.

read the thread and you'll find out how much protein you need (~100g for girls, ~150g for boys) and how many calories you should limit yourself to to lose weight (~1300 for girls, ~2000 for boys). Then, use a calorie counter and eat the way you normally would for a few days. Identify where all your non-protein calories are coming from and eliminate them or substitute them until you have the right ratios.

I have tons of little tricks now, like never ordering a side item, or getting a dessert instead of a side. Or getting 2 entrees and no sides if I'm really hungry. Or taking one of the buns off a burger if I've been eating a lot of bread that day.

Part of learning how to eat is also about unlearning all the bullshit you're told. Eggs are fine. Wheat/whole grains aren't amazing and in fact usually have more calories.

[ItalianStereotype]

Dude, I hate exercising and weight-lifting so much. Last summer I did the Couch-to-5k plan for like three straight months and there wasn't a day I did it where I felt good afterwards. I don't understand the whole feeling awesome after working out thing because I've never felt it. Exercising sucks.

Fuck the exercise part, just do the healthy eating part. That's way easier. You'll look like a beanpole faggy hipster but who gives a shit.

Also, the consequence of becoming obsessed with fitness is that you'll end up like Chojin, whose head probably exploded just by reading the opinions in this post.

CARDIO sucks. cardio blows 50 dicks, in fact. lifting makes you feel godly.

[kahljorn]

IM ON A LOW CARB DIET AND IVE ALREADY LOST TEN POUNDS>

I MOSTLY JUST DO LIGHT CARDIO AND IT WORKS PERFECTLY FOR ME

I LOOK AND FEEL GREAT!

ITS REALLY EASY TO DO TO I WOULD RECOMMEND IT TO ANYBODY INTERESTED IN BEING FIT AND HEALTHY

[Rongi]

do you still look like a girl who does a lot of cocaine

[kahljorn]

I LOOK LIKe A REALLY HOT CHICK WHO DOES COCAINE AND THEN GETS BANGED ALLL NIGHT

ALSO IF YOU"RE LOOKING TO LOSE SOME WEIGHT I WOULD RECOMMEND COCAINE

[Rongi]

that's such an expensive way to lose weight, man

[kahljorn]

IF YOU EVER NEED ADVICE ON A LOW CARB DIET I WOULD BE HAPPY TO HELP YOU OUT

[kahljorn]

NO IT COSTS ABOUT THE SAME BECAUSE THE MONEY YOU SPEND ON COCAINE IS CANCELED OUT BY THE MONEY YOU WOULD SPEND ON FOOD AND BEDS AND PILLOWS

METH COULD SAVE YOU A DIME TOO

[Rongi]

lay it on me

[kahljorn]

OKAY I WILL PM YOU SOME LINKS

[10,000 Volt Ghost]

I've considered it! Idk how much it costs to get lessons, or what if there is some kind of prerequisite to joining (like you have to already be physically fit or something)

I don't think I'll have time to start taking lessons for a while, though. But it's something I've thought about

YOU NEED TO MAN UP AND START DOING KRAV MAGA. FOR YOUR OWN GOOD.

[Chojin]

Dude, I hate exercising and weight-lifting so much. Last summer I did the Couch-to-5k plan for like three straight months and there wasn't a day I did it where I felt good afterwards. I don't understand the whole feeling awesome after working out thing because I've never felt it. Exercising sucks.

what part of couch to 5k involves weight lifting

were you running with an actual couch?

i may have identified the problem

[k0k0]

I never feel good after working out either though. Even just doing the elliptical for 50 minutes a day makes me feel shitty tired. Not energized at all.

[Rongi]

To be real real about you babies complaining exercise makes you feel shitty:

-It could be that you guys are overexerting yourselves or your form is inefficient, thus making you expend needless effort.
-Your diet might suck too, your body needs proper food for fuel during exercise

[kahljorn]

A PROPER LOW CARB DIET WLL HELP TO KEEP YOU ENERGETIC ANDMOtIvATED TO SUCCEED

[Zhukov]

I'm not an exercise fan, but I've always felt good after working out or playing strenuous sport.

[Ninjavenom]

Dude, I hate exercising and weight-lifting so much. Last summer I did the Couch-to-5k plan for like three straight months and there wasn't a day I did it where I felt good afterwards. I don't understand the whole feeling awesome after working out thing because I've never felt it. Exercising sucks.

Fuck the exercise part, just do the healthy eating part. That's way easier. You'll look like a beanpole faggy hipster but who gives a shit.
.

wat

You tried lifting? Lifting weights makes you feel godlike. It's like adding +1s to all your card stats until they're all better than when you first rolled. How did you not like this? What did you do?

And Rongi, you should enroll in a martial arts class anyway. I always recommend BJJ or a basic Tae-Kwon Do or Kempo/Kyokushin Karate class, see what you like. BJJ is cool because it doesn't require you to put in all sorts of extra work if you don't want to, and there's a significant mindgame element to it. Since it's all about principles of leverage and anticipation, it's a good art for anyone to learn, regardless of fitness or size. If you really get into it, you'll make time and effort for it.

Also, i like Chojin advice in this thread because it's pretty much the same way i eat. I gained 10 lbs over the summer eating pizza and drinking beer pretty much every night with my other friends who are also drunks. All i've done to cut back is lift 6 days a week, run once a week, and cut back my diet significantly. It's all about intake vs. output. If you put out more energy in calories than you take in, your body will resort to eating fat to acquire energy. Simple concept.

Also, where are these beefy pics, Chojin? I keep hearing about them but i see nothing

[Chojin]

i'm not huge at all, but compared to the skinnyfat nerds here i'm apparently some kind of monster

there's a pic of me in the op behind the spoilers, but here's another

http://www.i-mockery.com/chojin/joyeuse_110820.jpg

[Rongi]

why does your stomach look all gross

[kahljorn]

cause he used to eat a lot of cheeseburgers

oops im not supposed to talk about cheeseburgers in this thread :(

[Rongi]

:lol

[Esuohlim]

You tried lifting? Lifting weights makes you feel godlike. It's like adding +1s to all your card stats until they're all better than when you first rolled. How did you not like this? What did you do?

I've got these faggot noodle arms and I can barely lift shit :(

Excuses aside, though, I'm just really really lazy and I just plain don't like doing any physical activity other than walking

[elx]

+ sex

[Zhukov]

Well that muffin top is new to me. I don't think we were given that angle before.

[Supafly345]

I lost weight from lifting weights for the first time in my life because of the faq at the beginning of this thread. I had no idea they were so good at burning calories, I've always tried to cardio my weight off, but since my tendon injury I've had to turn to alternative means. Thanks thread!

[Chojin]

yeah i have a lot of stubborn fat left, it looks weird. i'll probably have to get surgery to remove the loose skin on my stomach. don't get fat, kids; nothing tastes as good as being fit feels.

supafly: another soul saved

kahljorn: BANNED

[Zhukov]

Wooing a personal trainer at the moment, and she makes me do push ups, lunges and burpees to prove that I can go the distance.

I fear this is going to make me leaner than I already am.

[Kitsa]

I have no idea what a burpee is. I thought it was a type of seed.

[Fathom Zero]

I have no idea what a burpee is. I thought it was a type of seed.

pickles

[10,000 Volt Ghost]

IyHb9OK4vPU

Chojin?

[Babs]

I feel really terrible for that towel.

[Zhukov]

I've just started to get a six pack for the first time in my life, not because of this thread though.

Thanks anyway.

[Rongi]

Update:

I am back at school. I do Taekwondo two days a week and yoga one day a week. I don't have a scale at my apartment, so idk how much weight i've lost so far. Feels like a lot though! I don't eat as much as I used to and I tend to eat healthier (my indulgence is those club crackers with the keebler elf on them fuck those things are good)

Through yoga I have learned how utterly fucked up our bodies are. Once you actually learn how to use your hips it's amazing how much more natural your body moves

i don't lift weights though cuz I heard it tightens up your muscles and that's not really copacetic with taekwondo

[10,000 Volt Ghost]

I use my hips to tighten up my boner muscle.

For reals started to use an ab lounge.

[Babs]

Shit, I heard two of them know karate.

[Evil Robot II]

No there isnt you sino- faggot go sell your viagra somewhere else

[Evil Robot II]

GOD DAMN CHINESE PEOPLE

[Evil Robot II]

Great, now that the spammer post have been deleted it looks like my comment was directed at babs, which it was not.

[Zhukov]

It looks funnier that way.

[Hangie]

Does how you cook your food make a difference at all? I've caught shit recently for frying my eggs instead of hardboiling them and for never steaming or boiling.

Also I am amazed I've never seen this thread before, it's like a mini-/fit/

[Zomboid]

A friend and I are going to start going to the gym a couple of times a week. Neither of us is fat, but it'd be nice to feel like I'm in good shape again. I used to actually be somewhat strong, and it showed at least a bit, but now I feel significantly weaker. Of course, I don't want to stop smoking so...we'll see how this goes.

Also, I've got the same problem as Chojin, RE: loose skin. I went from obese to normal size in like three months, and that shit has never really gotten re-absorbed. The very bottom of the stomach seems to be the only area, though. I, too, think I'll have to get surgery to get rid of that.

[Zomboid]

Does how you cook your food make a difference at all? I've caught shit recently for frying my eggs instead of hardboiling them and for never steaming or boiling.

Also I am amazed I've never seen this thread before, it's like a mini-/fit/

Well, yeah. Steaming is generally a lot healthier than frying. Besides, poached eggs just taste better than fried, I think.

[Big McLargehuge]

I remember all of you when you were fat and I liked you more.

[Tadao]

MORE OF YOU TO LOVE

[Chojin]

Does how you cook your food make a difference at all? I've caught shit recently for frying my eggs instead of hardboiling them and for never steaming or boiling.

Also I am amazed I've never seen this thread before, it's like a mini-/fit/

It doesn't really matter how you cook your food, aside from the nutritional value of the oils/ingredients you use. Paleo fgts would disagree, of course.

[kahljorn]

steaming your food makes most of the nutrients go into the water instead of staying in the food :O
if you're gonna steam food you should do it like.. in a sauce so so you get to keep the nutrients.

but this has more to do with health/cooking than being a muscle jerk.

[Chojin]

plz to be defining 'nutrients'

is it like those 'toxins' PTs tell you you sweat out in saunas

[Big McLargehuge]

Water soluble vitamins and minerals?

[kahljorn]

:lol

[Hangie]

Chojin, have you ever taken creatine or any supplements at all like tons o' whey?

[kahljorn]

he told me that tons o' ghey is a key part of his diet

[ItalianStereotype]

whey is pretty key for any serious lifter and chojin is more creatine than man now.

[Zomboid]

he told me that tons o' ghey is a key part of his diet

:lol

[Chojin]

Water soluble vitamins and minerals?

so any vitamin that isn't fat soluble is a nutrient? that is retarded; be quiet son

Chojin, have you ever taken creatine or any supplements at all like tons o' whey?

both of those, yes. creatine makes me feel bloated but helped my lifts by about 5 lbs each. whey is important if you don't get enough protein in your diet (and on a lifting diet, bros need about 150g/day so it's almost required unless your last name is perdue or something).

ephedrine was and is the best supplement i've taken. it's srs shit though

[Big McLargehuge]

so any vitamin that isn't fat soluble is a nutrient? that is retarded; be quiet son What? I could broadly define nutrient if you need me to. The nutrients lost in the steaming process are water soluble vitamins like Vitamin C and B complexes.

Son?

[Babs]

If you want good quality nutrients just suck down some GH or some Canna, if you don't make it, you were never meant to walk on this earth. If you're hangie, just keep sucking down your "ghey" and you'll get the protein needed. Hope this was helpful.

[kahljorn]

ephedrine was and is the best supplement i've taken. it's srs shit though

:lol

wait i thougt you lost all your weight through hard work not through baby meth

[kahljorn]

hey guys here's my totally serious thread about losing weight the secret is calories and building muscles

also i use meth

[Chojin]

http://hotnfit.com/ecstack

What? I could broadly define nutrient if you need me to. The nutrients lost in the steaming process are water soluble vitamins like Vitamin C and B complexes.

Son?

boyo. i guess if you need to follow some queer paleo diet you can totally get that 1.2 micrograms of C your body craves like electrolytes

or you could take a multi

or get it from the rest of your diet

[kahljorn]

www.methismadeoutofephedrineandyouareacrackheadand thereasonwhyyoulostsomuchweightiscauseyoutookanapp etitesuppressant/upper/amphedimene

[kahljorn]

chojin if you mixed your special diet with matches and iodine you would have meth

[Big McLargehuge]

boyo. i guess if you need to follow some queer paleo diet you can totally get that 1.2 micrograms of C your body craves like electrolytes

or you could take a multi

or get it from the rest of your diet

You can get vitamin c from lots of places but if you want to get it from your veggies don't steam them. Clearly you have lot of opinions on diet and exercise, Big Man.

[Big McLargehuge]

Also, can we get a mod to move this to the Sports and Health forum :rolleyes

[kahljorn]

bigmclargehuge the funnier and smarter you're being in this thread the higher chance you have of being banned :O

[Big McLargehuge]

Does Chojin take mad doses of legal meth and go on banning rages?:0

[Evil Robot II]

Take enough ephedrine and you will become gay like most fitness enthusiasts.
http://www.yourcelebritystuff.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/01/Fitness-Guru-Jack-LaLanne-Dies-at-Age-96.jpg

G o wear you man leotard someplace else queenie, nobody likes your penises here

[Chojin]

chojin if you mixed your special diet with matches and iodine you would have meth

that's nice

also i hear fluoride makes rat poison

someone should really look into that

[kahljorn]

:lol

that'd be funny if i wasn't completely serious.

[kahljorn]

just look up how to make meth and they will all have ephedrine in it:
Illicit methamphetamine is more commonly made by the reduction (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Redox) of ephedrine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ephedrine) or pseudoephedrine (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pseudoephedrine),wikipedia

wheres colonel flagg and esulohim to point out the chemistry behind it :O

[kahljorn]

i guess what im trying to say is be careful chojin you never know when your drug will turn against you
and ephedrine+caffeine is sort of a dangerous combination too

also maybe you shouldn't have a fitness/advice thread if you're gonna recommend dangerous meth filled diets.

[ItalianStereotype]

that aside, the e/c stack is pretty useful for serious lifting! it helps drop fat like crazy, but you can still keep your gains while on a deficit.

[kahljorn]

i hear ya i got tons of friends that do meth and lift

[Chojin]

i know what you mean man, sometimes i just come home in an ephedrine-fueled rage and just start punching my girlfriend out. i don't even realize i'm doing it until i've somehow made it to the bathroom to wash all the blood off my hands. then i look into the mirror and wonder what i've become.

ephedrine. not even once.

[kahljorn]

i think somebody needs help :(

[Evil Robot II]

I thought ephedrine was for unstuffing peoples noses?

[kahljorn]

or gullets :O

[Big McLargehuge]

I took your advice and started taking ephedrine, i can stop whenever i want. >: