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| Jun 19th, 2003 04:16 PM | |||||||
| KevinTheOmnivore |
Quote:
http://www.commondreams.org/views03/0618-09.htm Published on Wednesday, June 18, 2003 by the Seattle Weekly Impeachable Offense by Geov Parrish FINALLY, AND FAR too late, national media are discovering that the Bush administration's case for invading Iraq was a combination of willfully gross exaggerations and flat-out lies. For weeks, various recently leaked or released documents have confirmed that there has never been much, if any, evidence in American and British files that even plausibly pointed to an Iraqi threat of either nuclear or other banned weapons, or Iraqi links to Al Qaeda. Intelligence analysts in both governments did not believe such threats existed. The new revelations, combined with an utter lack of post-invasion evidence (weather-balloon trailers notwithstanding) that such claims were ever true, are an enormous political scandal in Britain. However, their content merely confirms what opponents of the proposed invasion claimed since last summer: that most of the endless variety of Bush assertions "proving" either Iraqi WMDs or links to Al Qaeda were, on their face, preposterous. This wasn't simply an abstract policy debate; it was a matter of the Bush administration's swearing to Congress, America, and the world that the threat to U.S. security—the sole legal justification for invading, conquering, and occupying Iraq—was based on evidence that did not, in fact, exist. The Bush administration made such assertions repeatedly, for more than half a year, and it continues to do so. Such assertions are not simply a typically appalling campaign of Bush administration lies. They are an impeachable offense. For months, various, mostly liberal and progressive critics of Bush have been whipping up impeachment calls. Such calls have been delusional, boiling down, essentially, to the fact that Bush's critics hate a number of his policies. There were no pending or existing corruption indictments; no evidence of criminal wrongdoing; and no conceivable political route by which the votes for impeachment could be mustered. It was a nonstarter. Until now. SHOULD THE EVIDENCE hold up—and it will—the Bush administration's lies constitute either an unwitting or witting effort to put American soldiers in harm's way, guaranteeing the deaths of some. America's military was deployed for reasons Bush and his entire foreign-policy apparatus either knew or should have known were false. They did so to launch a war whose unprovoked nature was a sharp departure from international law and norms. Bush claimed the legal authority for his invasion was last October's congressional vote. On the eve of that vote, in a major speech aimed at Congress, Bush claimed satellite photos gave irrefutable evidence that Iraq was rebuilding its nuclear-weapons program. He intoned, mere days after his intelligence agencies put the date at 2010, that Iraq would be able to use such weapons within a year. "Facing clear evidence of peril," Bush told Congress, America, and the world, "we cannot wait for the final proof that could come in the form of a mushroom cloud." Plenty of the administration's own experts had told the White House this was nonsense. From August to March, Bush and his team insisted, first, that they had evidence which actually did not exist. Then they presented evidence that was either long out-dated or simply invented. In doing so, Bush and his top officials caused the unnecessary deaths of a lot of U.S. soldiers. The outrage thus far is coming from the media and from the British example. With a few honorable exceptions, such as Sen. Robert Byrd and Rep. Dennis Kucinich, it is not coming from congressional Democrats. Given Democratic spinelessness, no attack on the fitness of George W. Bush and his band of neocon zealots can take hold without widespread public anger, including that of independents and at least some Republicans. The use of duplicity to lead soldiers to their graves should inspire exactly such outrage. The unprovoked invasion, conquest, and occupation of Iraq should never have happened. Instead, the White House claimed that Bush spent several months agonizing over whether to launch an invasion, one he had already approved. BEFORE AND AFTER his secret decision, his administration's claims were largely false. Bush used those claims to sacrifice the lives of American soldiers—along with other coalition soldiers and countless Iraqis, soldier and civilian alike. And he continues his lies. Iraq is half the size of South Africa, whose banned weapons were found instantly when apartheid ended. Iraq is not, as Bush protests, "a big country"; in two months, American soldiers have exhausted search possibilities. Nor have Iraq's weapons fled the country. Or been found. They have not existed for years. But soldiers died because George W. Bush said they did. For this egregious abuse of his oath of office, he should be impeached. © 1998-2003 Seattle Weekly ### |
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| Jun 12th, 2003 03:32 PM | |||||||
| Protoclown |
Quote:
Calling someone Jewish is not an insult. Particularly if the person you're "insulting" actually is Jewish. But there again, you could call me Jewish if you want, and I won't be insulted at all. |
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| Jun 12th, 2003 03:23 PM | |||||||
| mburbank | Judaism is a religion a culture, and an ethnicity, or a few ethnicities to be more precise. We've been around while. The religion has much to recomend it, although I'm put off by it's exlusionary nature, ie. we are God's chosen, you are not. The culture is my historical background, and like my ethnicity isn't something I could escape even if I wanted to, which I don't. | ||||||
| Jun 12th, 2003 03:06 PM | |||||||
| Cybernetico | I personally think religion isn't a race that you're born with, but a lifestyle or belief | ||||||
| Jun 12th, 2003 12:10 PM | |||||||
| mburbank |
"I could give a fuck less about what you think." -Calamity ClamBake Translation? "Oh! Oh! I don't CARE!! Haven't I thaid it and thaid it?! WHY doethn't ANYONE beLIEVE me?!?" "You defend the fact you are Jewish when you don't even practice it." -Thtupid ol' Vinth I don't need to practice it. I have it down. I was born with it. See, my Mother is Jewish, so I am. That's all it takes. Know how I know? It says so in the bible. Hard as this may be for you to concieve of, Jews concider themsleves a culture, a people, several distinct historical bloodlines and a religion. I don't need to defend it. It simply is. Defend your own religion, porno boy. I went to two colleges, both private. Reed in Portalnd Ore. and Emerson in Boston. How 'bout that? Wrong again. "You are not worth the time to make up a better insult." -Catholic Thamurai Translation? "I'm a lathy, thtupid bag of thit. Pluth, I'm about aath funny ath thcabies." "I also believe that you would have sold out Christ for 30 pieces of silver if He were here today." -Father O'clambake Do you? Cause I was just picturing you gambling for his clothes. |
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| Jun 12th, 2003 11:44 AM | |||||||
| VinceZeb |
A.) I could give a fuck less about what you think. You defend the fact you are Jewish when you don't even practice it. It is just something for you to cry about if you ever get "discriminated" against. So please, don't tell me how to be a good Catholic and I'll continue to mock you for dismissing your faith and heritage for the the percieved allmighty beliefs that only serve to destroy the people that you "indentify" with. B) I bet you went to college. Your adversion to facts and figures and common sence would indicate you were educated in a government school system. C) Yes, you are Jewish. You are not worth the time to make up a better insult. And it must bother you because you bring it up every time. I also believe that you would have sold out Christ for 30 pieces of silver if He were here today. |
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| Jun 12th, 2003 11:37 AM | |||||||
| mburbank |
A.) I don't hate religion. I think you're a shitty version of a Catholic. There's a world of difference between those two thoughts. I actually have a great deal of respect for religion, though nothing but contempt for folks who think they can use it to hide what horrible people they are, like a gym towel draped over your prong. Did you make a clean confession about your web site, your Jew Bashing and your general repulsiveness before your last communion? 'Cause I'd hate to see you get hit by truck and go straight to hell. B.) My entire body went to college. If only your ass is going to school now, that could explain a lot of the shit you talk. C.) Did you know I'm Jewish? You can make fun of that if you want, it'll be easy. Especially if you don't mind making yourself look like a horrible bag of shit, which it's clear you don't. |
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| Jun 12th, 2003 11:28 AM | |||||||
| VinceZeb |
I don't know max, did your enjoy the fact that your daddy was able to put your ass through school becuase the Nazi's paid him his 30 pieces to sell out Anne Frank and her hiding place? I figure that is where you get your religion-hatred and your uppityness from. |
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| Jun 12th, 2003 11:17 AM | |||||||
| mburbank |
Your assumption, repeatedly refuted, that we're all Clinton fans here, is yet more proof your are as dense as diamonds. Know what I did like though? The surplus. Clinton? Don't miss him so much. The Surplus? Really sad to see it go. Did you employ YOUR stupid ass style when Bush senior was President? Or were you still in pull-ups back then? |
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| Jun 11th, 2003 11:47 PM | |||||||
| VinceZeb | Zosimus, did you employ your cute little cliches and quotes when Clinton was president? | ||||||
| Jun 11th, 2003 04:35 PM | |||||||
| GAsux |
Soiled undergarments... Quote:
Sorry. I need a babywipe because I think I might have just pooped my pants. That was pretty funny. Hey, maybe Dubya doesn't exist either. He could just be fictional-Hitler like figure created for us to believe we are doing right so we keep our mouths shut. |
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| Jun 11th, 2003 03:45 PM | |||||||
| Zosimus |
A government that robs Peter to pay Paul can always depend upon the support of Paul. -George Bernard Shaw (1856-1950) A patriot must always be ready to defend his country against his government. -Edward Abbey (1927-1989) US author By definition, a government has no conscience, sometimes it has a policy, but nothing more. -Albert Camus (1913-1960) |
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| Jun 11th, 2003 03:06 PM | |||||||
| Bennett | Can I get the government to shut you up? | ||||||
| Jun 11th, 2003 02:56 PM | |||||||
| Cybernetico |
Back on topic, stretching the truth is practically a government pastime. There are probobly more that they dont tell us then they do, and it's obvious. The government can put anyone to silence if they want, they control what we learn and know. As far as we know, we could have only done the war for the oil, and maybe saddam doesnt exist but is a fictional hitler-like figure created for us to believe we are doing right so we keep our mouths shut. I mean, look at Hiroshima. We were told that we dropped fliers for over a week telling people to abandon so they would have minimal casualties. That was a lie. We were shown recreations shortly after showing soldiers who were flying the plane that they were being flakked at and many died in the attempt, yet one plane went in and there was no defense. We were even told that millions upon millions of American lives would have been saved because it would have ended the war quickly, yet estimates really showed that that was a total lie. There are even still mysteries about it. Were there any other ways? How many died exactly? How many people got a 1UP from the mushroom cloud? We may NEVER know..... |
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| Jun 11th, 2003 11:06 AM | |||||||
| mburbank | I just think it's kind of sweet how focused he is on you. Kind of romantic in a hideous, rough trade, inadequate way. | ||||||
| Jun 11th, 2003 11:01 AM | |||||||
| KevinTheOmnivore | Vince's sexual preference seems to be the only thing he's willing and/or capable of answering. | ||||||
| Jun 11th, 2003 09:20 AM | |||||||
| mburbank |
"Kev, get back to your position in life: Sucking my cock." - The Clambaker "I'm getting pretty damn tired of holding your hand" -Kevin "Kevin, why do you want to hold my hand? Are you a fag?" -Vinthent LaClambake My money is on Vinth being the fag, which is fine. It is his prison inmate approach to dating I dislike. |
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| Jun 11th, 2003 08:14 AM | |||||||
| VinceZeb | Kevin, why do you want to hold my hand? Are you a fag? | ||||||
| Jun 10th, 2003 07:07 PM | |||||||
| ranxer |
it should be enough.. but its not, not with this administration.. i think they have survived many, many lies so far. i'd like to just add this lie/crime to a long list that could ALL lead to impeachment if we have some whistleblowers but without witnesses coming forward our representatives are affraid to bring any of these up for fear of the smears this administration can lay out when it turns its monstrous head in a dissenters direction. for those that like audio there's an interview with dean at: http://www.democracynow.org/article....3/06/10/166246 |
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| Jun 10th, 2003 11:59 AM | |||||||
| KevinTheOmnivore |
Re: Yeah Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
The reason he did this, and the reason he to this day stands by that stance, is that the guidelines he had set before him was a complete 100% Iraqi disarmament. Although he could atest that most of what Iraq had was gone, he couldn't prove it was all gone (particularly any kinds of chem. weapons). So, with that said, lets assume they still had anthrax, which they admitted to having. Anthrax has a shelf life, in IDEAL storage conditions, of no more than two years (that's a generous guess, to my recollection). Now, our teams in there now, as well as the UN teams, inspected these places. Not only have they not found anything, but they have also learned that these facilities were far from "ideal." (Don't even go to the "moving van chem. lab" farce). In 1998, when Clinton enacted Desert Fox, he in fact had the UN team pulled out of Iraq so he could bomb the country. If Clinton and Daschle were so concerned, why would Clinton indefintely pull out the inspection team??? Quote:
Quote:
Bundy was proven guilty. Saddam has not been proven guilty of these crimes. Quote:
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| Jun 10th, 2003 11:02 AM | |||||||
| GAsux |
Yup Max, I noticed Dubya saying recently things along the lines of "We know Iraq HAD a weapons program". It seems to me the angle they are going to pursue is that we know they had it, they just likely destroyed it before we could get in there. That's my guess, anyway. |
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| Jun 10th, 2003 10:19 AM | |||||||
| VinceZeb |
Kevin, you must be a moron. Did not Tom Daschle sit there on capital hill back in 98 and talk about the threat that Iraq is against us? Did Clinton not talk about that as well? Other countries agreed as well, such as France and Germany and Britian and Italy. We had just as much if not one or two more countries that agreed with us this time that Saddam had WMD. And do you really think that Saddam would leave that shit in the open? That he wouldn't hide the weapons as soon as he knew some shit was up? You would probably let Ted Bundy go too if he got rid of all the bodies but everyone had a multitude of other evidence. Kev, get back to your position in life: Sucking my cock. |
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| Jun 10th, 2003 09:36 AM | |||||||
| mburbank |
Rice, Powell, and now Bush have over reacted to the criticism and made some classic political mistakes, or at very least gambels, in the last few days. They have all asserted that not only was intelligence not abused in any way, it was accurate, and WMD WILL be found in Iraq. The only wiggle room they've left themselves is how long it may take. Suppose we head into the election with nothing found but three totally clean trucks who's functions are now in dispute? Can a Bush running for office then say "Well, I meant WMD will be found historically, or perhaps archeologically."? Opinion polls being what they are, they should have just sat tight and said nothing more than that they had and have faith in the intelligence they acted upon. |
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| Jun 10th, 2003 07:11 AM | |||||||
| FS | I was mostly musing on the situation in my reply. I would like to see a deep investigation into this matter, but I haven't a clue who would be willing, daring or interested enough to make a case out of it. | ||||||
| Jun 10th, 2003 12:00 AM | |||||||
| GAsux |
Yeah Kev, Let's not fight anymore. Please? Anyway, I'm not saying so bad shit likely didn't go down. What I'm saying is that I have very little confidence in the idea that any significant member of the current administration will suffer any consequences as a result. My point was, it's going to take a photograph of Professor Dubya in the library with the candlestick to make anything work. Short of blatantly obvious proof, my feeling is that ultimately it will be much ado about nothing. The Dems will cry foul, the Republicans will rally, and ultimately there won't be enough concrete proof to lead to an impeachment, or even a resignation. But I want to re-emphasize something that I brought up in another thread somewhere that I think is very relevant. 9/11 changed a lot, for everyone. Administration officials, intel agencies, etc have historically been intensely loyal to the administration, even when they disagree privately. Those who've worked inside have always said that they felt a certain obligation to "serve" the administration even if they personally disagreed. After 9/11, the finger pointing was all geared towards the intel agencies. There are men and women who have worked in those agencies their entire lives busting their ass. I don't think they so much appreciated being called out like that. The CIA/DIA/FBI became the fall guys. I don't think they intend to let that happen this time. What I'm saying is it's relatively unprecedented for so many intel types to come forward and admit that they were pressured by administration officials, etc. Its not a case of one random crusader ala Dan Ellsberg taking a stand. It's the whole of the agencies. Its they who will be the thorn in Dubyas side because I don't think they are so eager to take the blame again. |
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