I've decided.....

[argonath]

Originally Posted by WhiteRat

...the Air Force dorms at Kunsan AB in Korea are infested with roaches, high levels of mold, and are currently scheduled for demolition...

Ha. I'll have to tell that to my buddy. He was stationed there for a while in the late 90s (a good while longer than he was told). BTW, WhiteRat, your avatar is intriguing to me for some reason...is the story behind it posted anywhere?

To the OP, I'd also recommend a year of college, or a year of working/travelling before you make the leap to the armed forces. Let your brain get out of the high school mindset for a while, then make a decision.

[WhiteRat]

Originally Posted by argonath

Ha. I'll have to tell that to my buddy. He was stationed there for a while in the late 90s (a good while longer than he was told). BTW, WhiteRat, your avatar is intriguing to me for some reason...is the story behind it posted anywhere?

To the OP, I'd also recommend a year of college, or a year of working/travelling before you make the leap to the armed forces. Let your brain get out of the high school mindset for a while, then make a decision.

The taking a year to find yourself or the college thing is a decent idea as well.

The fellow in the avatar is Crunchy Blac, formerly of Three 6 Mafia:
http://youtube.com/watch?v=PuEzZfugpak

The gal next to him is a friend of my brother. She fucked him after a concert in a hotel. My bro said it was the best night of partying he ever had. He also said that Crunchy Blac was one of the nicest and most courteous guys that he's ever met.

[Zomboid]

Until he started slammin dat white pussy, yo. THEN HE WENT INTO RAGE MODE!

[Dr. Octogonopus]

Originally Posted by Tadao

All I'm saying Doc is that you had better be prepared to be hated by the world and your own country. I don't care one way or the other. I'm not being a dick about it, it's just how things are. America is not loved and our armed forces are taking the heat for it at home and abroad.

I've already felt that hate. A lot of my friends don't agree with my decision, but they support me. That's really all I ask for. I can understand why people don't like the military, based on the war in Iraq. I don't really agree with the war either. But I'm joining the armed forces to support my country if and when a real war flares up. And I know the possible psychological consequences of war, or rather the inevitable consequences. If it happens that I go nuts from war, then it will be from my own doing, and nobody else's.

[Fathom Zero]

Hell yeah.

[Dr. Octogonopus]

Besides, I didn't waste my spring break working on the whole yard for some other country to go and take it away!

[Tadao]

Totally! Little does he know that the Japanese already own his lawn!

[DeadKennedys]

Stop talking about Japan. :/

You said you want to join the armed forces to support your country if and when a real war flares up. Even if we don't agree with the reasons we went to war, we are in a real war, and you probably will be sent to the real Iraq

[Dr. Octogonopus]

By a real war, I meant something that was more of a serious conflict that would be a threat to america or any other allied nations. If you look at past conflicts, the Iraq war is practically nothing. I know it sounds terrible, with the 4,000 American soldiers that have died in the conflict, but all the other wars lost thousands more Americans, and the wars were all about preserving America. That is what I believe in.
And Tadao, I checked my fertilizer, my lawn belongs to Peru.

[Tadao]

Sorry Doc, That post is out of context now because the others where removed. I " "ed at your lawn joke at someone thought I was being a jerk about it.

I'm serious when I say that I don't care if you go or not. It's not my choice and I can't hold my life experiences to yours. I said what I thought you should know and you happen to understand. I hit a nerve with some of the other people who serve or have served. That was all. Don't develop that nerve that they have. Stay tough and don't get upset when your country doesn't like you, your country would find a reason to hate you even if you didn't go.

[DeadKennedys]

Originally Posted by Dr. Octogonopus

By a real war, I meant something that was more of a serious conflict that would be a threat to america or any other allied nations. If you look at past conflicts, the Iraq war is practically nothing. I know it sounds terrible, with the 4,000 American soldiers that have died in the conflict, but all the other wars lost thousands more Americans, and the wars were all about preserving America. That is what I believe in.

If you're hoping for another WWII, this ain't it. But the Iraq war is one of the more serious. It's destroyed the image of America across the world, and more importantly, it's demonstrated how much trouble the world's most powerful nation has with a little third world militia. Not only have we failed to suppress them, we've only strengthened their ranks; Al-Qaeda says the Iraq war is their greatest recruitment tool, ever.

If you look back at the foreign policy of the mid-90's where Iraq and Saddam were THE key for world supremacy, it's kinda easy to see that we went into this war for the wrong reasons. We could have declared war on Al-Qaeda and kept the pressure on Bin Laden, rather than the extremely vague (and impossible) "War on Terror", and probably had him by now. Did anyone but the hippies disagree with rounding up Bin Laden and executing him? BUT I'M RAMBLING.

tl;dr version: Pick a better time

[Dr. Octogonopus]

The LAST thing I want is another world war. And I still can't really figure out how we jumped from Al Qaeda to Iraq, it just doesn't make since to me. And I think it's very misleading to say we're declaring war on terrorism; terrorism in itself is a great military plan. The ideal (I'm sure you know this) is to scare the shit out of them so it kills their morale. The reason why everyone is so irked about it is the way Iraq and the Al Qaeda are waging it. So terrorism in itself isn't bad, it's just that the way the press is showing us about it, everyone assumes that this is the only way to use terrorism.
Tadao, i honestly don't really care if people don't agree with my decision. It would be a damned hypocritical thing to join the army to defend our ideals, then get all pissy when people USE their freedom of speech. Sorry if I've come off like that. It's kinda hard to tell sometimes, ya know?

[Tadao]

Oh, don't worry about me I think you'll do fine in the services. Chin Up!

[Colonel Flagg]

Originally Posted by DeadKennedys

Not only have we failed to suppress them, we've only strengthened their ranks; Al-Qaeda says the Iraq war is their greatest recruitment tool, ever.

Originally Posted by Dr. Octogonopus

[...] I think it's very misleading to say we're declaring war on terrorism; terrorism in itself is a great military plan. The ideal (I'm sure you know this) is to scare the shit out of them so it kills their morale.

This is starting to look like a political thread.

At the risk of derailing this discussion entirely, I'd like to point out that the turning point of the Vietnam war was, in fact, an incredible defeat inflicted on the VC during the holidays. Dubbed the "Tet" offensive, the VC's defeat was overshadowed by the penetration of their soldiers into "safe" territory. This was incredibly demoralizing to the South, and as such strengthened the ability of the VC to recruit soldiers.

The parallels to the Battle of Trenton (conducted on Christmas) are eerie. It seemed as if the VC took a page out of our own struggle for independence nearly 200 years later, when we were viewed as the imperialist aggressors.

The relevance? We are obstinate in our inability to learn from our own history. 200 years ago or yesterday, the same tactics are being used time and again against us, and in my opinion, we cannot win any war in this way.

Strange, that Bush Sr. and Gen. Schwarzkopf figured out the way to beat the "enemy" - demoralize and decimate an existing government into submission, then leave and let them pick up the pieces. Too bad Jr. didn't inherit his "intelligence".

Getting back to the topic (sorry, rant off!) Doc Ock, I can say truthfully, were I in your shoes, I'd do anything I could to not go into the armed forces. However, I will respect your decision grudgingly - I'd respect it more if you at least waited until you had experienced some life after high school, whether it be living on your own, going to college or trade school, or anything else. It seems to me that you're making life choices too early that will affect you in life too profoundly.

[Dr. Octogonopus]

Oh no, the rant was interesting!
Well, I said a little before that I did want to go to college for at least a year or so. I'm thinking zoology. It seems like it'd be pretty rash to haul off and enlist right after school, because hey, who knows, I might just decide that I really love zoology more than I thought. Besides, it doesn't hurt to have a backup plan.

[Pub Lover]

While the US must love saying that it's the sole superpower, & that it runs the world... Maybe it could stop to wonder weather it's that sort of bullshit that makes the world hate them.

Join the Army now kid, who cares if it effects your life in anyway. You can do anything, do what you want.

[Tadao]

Shut up Pub or you're next

[Pub Lover]

Come & get me, cripple boy!

In the time it'll take for you to get up my front steps I could join the military & stop being a useless shit.

[Tadao]

That's it. I'm invading you. When is it summer there?

[Pub Lover]

November to Febuary.

[Pandajuice]

My best friend joined the army about 5 years ago and he loved it. He was an engineer and always came home with really great stories and wide eyes. He didn't mind doing a tour in Iraq either and his favourite story is the one in which he was nearly killed by insurgents while defending a bridge. He was always obsessed with tactical RTS games and Warhammer 40k so I think he just got off on being in a "real" battle.

Having said that, I'd recommend against joining the army, at least right now. You don't want to get sent to Iraq and put in harm's way for no reason. You're not defending America over there and you won't even know why you're there. Unless you're an armchair general like my buddy, I don't think you'll enjoy it.

The army is really good for people who have nowhere else to go, no opportunities, or no direction as to a career. It lets you try out a bunch of different disciplines on the government's dime and as you said, discharges you with a nice pension. But if you already have aspirations to go to college, then do that. You can always join later if college doesn't work out and Iraq is out of the picture.

[Dr. Octogonopus]

Well the thing is, I have a bunch of different things I want to do, but I do terrible at school. I absolutely cannot pay attention unless it interests me, no matter how hard I tried. I was even on hardcore ADHD medicines, but it only made me practically a zombie, I was pretty much shambling from class to class without much thought. It also made me lose over forty pounds, because I would take a few bites of lunch and feel like I was going to throw up. So I can't take it, it's no use to me. So my friends have already gotten ads from all these colleges, and I've gotten nothing. So it looks to me like an Army scholarship is my best bet.

[Fathom Zero]

Oh yeah, Damn That David's in the coast guard. He's hardly posted here recently. Probably because he's having too much fun flying around the Washington coast in a jet boat.

[Sethomas]

Since I was a high school senior on 11 September 2001, and since I'm a philosophically-inclined pensive douche, I've done a ton of thinking about the armed services for a long time. In fact, the day before that event they put up fliers to sign up for the ASVAB, and two days later I signed up for it out of expectation that it might have a huge bearing on my future whether I liked it or not.

In short, I am in favor of the military as it stands in the American ideal, but I'm hugely opposed to how I've noticed it to actually work. The idea that we should reward our young people with an education for becoming a functioning and visible extension of democracy abroad--that is fantastic. The reality that we're sending them off in one of the most counter-productive wars in history (and I DO know my history) that makes the rest of the world hate us is just sickening. The fact that we treat our veterans like shit after the fact is unspeakable, let alone the question of private contractors gleefully sponging the money.

Even before the Trade Center attacks, I thought that America could benefit well from compulsory military service. It's kind of a game theory issue; if all my classmates had to join the services, then I would do so without complaint. This would be especially great if the bulk of the military was applied to civil projects, as well it should be in times of peace.

My situation was that after I took the test and everyone was talking about a draft under their breath, I was one signature away from becoming a nuclear engineer for the Navy. I didn't sign it because there was a war going on, and if I HAD to be involved then I wanted a conscionable position. With the navy actively bombing Kabul and later Baghdad, I decided that I would rather take the risk of getting shot at daily than to seal my place in involvement of civilian attacks. And, to be perfectly honest, when the Afghan war began and I was sickened at the disproportionate reliance on bombings I did invest some amount of effort into figuring out which European country would make the best home for me as soon as I hit age 18. With the draft not ever happening, this all amounted to my just going to college and participating in war protests.

So, what I tell people is that they should join if it makes sense for them in terms of personal development, financial growth, and sense of conscience. None of that fits for me, but I absolutely support anyone who wishes to better themselves with armed service. Yes, it's unfortunate that an idiotic war is involved right now, but all humans in all of history have been victims of their time and place.

[WhiteRat]

Originally Posted by Sethomas

So, what I tell people is that they should join if it makes sense for them in terms of personal development, financial growth, and sense of conscience.

This is by far the best advice given in this thread. Really, it sums everything up.