Mar 20th, 2003, 11:41 AM
Hinky. Shame on you. While as I've stated I think getting rid of your Dixie Chicks records for any reason other than their music is stupid, I don't 'hate' people doing it. Free speech is free speech, and It's one of my favorite American Freedoms. I endorse their right to not buy the Dixie Chicks Music.
"The ultimate display of freedom is capitalism."
I find that a very depressing statement. The 'Ultimate'? I find an awful lot of things about America more inspirational. I'd place it in the top ten, though, so don't get all uppity and say I hate what America stnds for. But theirs a reason we say "The pursuit of Hapiness" when the original phrase in it's place was "Property" I like property, too though, so don't get a rash.
"Well, the first thing people will notice is the fact that you are always so quick to focus on the negative aspects of what this country has done without stating the positive things we have accomplished. And you are always taking the postive and trying bring it down using 3rd rate conspiracy theories that nobody believes. Also, "averting doom" defined by you is economic despair and lots of dead American soldiers. "
While much tht you just said, particularly wht others make of my posts, is highly arguable, I'll note that you can't even put into words a concept "America Stands For" that I hate. Let me try to help you.
Are you saying "America stands for accentuating positive aspects of it's culture proportionately with negative in discussion." I think I may have missed that in civics class.
Start threads on Freedom, and you'll see where I agree with and embrace what America Stands for. Start threads on Bush, and you'll see where I disagree. I am often concerned with how America fail to live up to the Things it Stands for. I'm a big believer in actually doingt the Things you Stand For.
Perhaps you are saying "America Stands for not taking the postive and trying bring it down using 3rd rate conspiracy theories that nobody believes."
Well, since I belive them, that's somebody. A lot of people believe them. I'm really a centrist as far as conspiracy theory goes. Wasn't it you who posted the article on some secret force being behind peace protests? I'm not accusing you, it might have been someone else. In any case, I think "America stands for a healthy skeptecism where government is concerned". I think that's why we have three branches of govrnments, checks and balances, the vote, a free press, freedom of speech etc. I imagine you find my tack depressing, but can't recall any great merican writing embracing the concept "America stands for not being a bummer". Perhaps, perhaps, America stands for more optomism than I generally express, but I think that would be way down on the list of what it stands for, near dressing more neatly than I tend to.
Your last charge might be worded "America stands for not defining "averting doom" as economic despair and lots of dead American soldiers. "
You might well have something there, if indeed that was what I did. I don't embrace a bad economy (which I suffer in along with you) or dead soldiers any more than I assume you embrace the concept of dead Iraqi children. I assume, though, that you see some number of dead iraqi children as a regretable, tragic inevitability on the road to a safer world. I see W not getting re-elected as a major step in averting World War III. That's not a conspiracy theory, as I don't think it's what he wants. It is my politucal judgement, to which I'm entitled. It is my sincere hope that the American people will be moved by multiple factors to unseat him, as they did his father. It is my sincere hope that this could and will happen without ANY deaths (too late for that already) as I too pray for Iraqis and Americans and British and all human beings. I imagine you think I pray incorrectly, or doubt my prayers even count as such, but I think "America stands for Freedom of Religion". I find the entire situation tragic. I feel this is a conflict between two individual men, and I think history and God will judge them both harshly for draggng so many innocents into the fray with them. It causes me great unhapiness that I believe Bush will not loose the next election if this stage of our new foreign policy comes with little cost to America. For you too construe this as an active desire for people to suffer, especially while endorsing war, shows to me a shocking lack of perspective.
While I disagree with you on almost everything, I am capable of seeing your political viewpoint. I do not beieve you are capable of acknowledging the existence of mine, let alone seeing it. This is the nature of our respective boxes.
I would suggest that your inability to express clearly what America Stand For that you think I hate stems not so much from your skill with words as the fact that your gut feelings about me and what I do or do not hate cannot be stated as a Hatred of American Ideals. At one time in our history, the government 'stood for' the holding of slaves as the 'ultimate' expression of Capitalism. Did abolitionists 'hate' what 'America' stood for?
If you cannot put it into words, it may be because it isn't true.
It could be because it's a lie.
I have my own interpretation of what it means to be an American. It's based on history and the great documents of our founding fathers. When I believe we do not aspire to our better nature, I feel shame BECAUSE I love what America Stands For. You claim your understanding of the bible is legitimate becuase it is the divine word of God and not open to different interpretations. Do you feel the same way about our constitution, our rights, our freedoms? Is Patriotism a mark from God which can only be epxressed in ways clear to you?
And is it really so surprising I find you prideful, you who know what it means to be a real American?