Kulturkampf's Fun-Time Philosophy Jamboree! (merged)

[Kulturkampf]

Originally Posted by Dr. Boogie

"I'm a man who discovered the wheel and built the Eiffel Tower out of metal and brawn. That's what kind of man I am. You're just a woman with a small brain. With a brain a third the size of us. It's science. "

Yeah, that is what I was really getting at, right?

It's hard to say. It's all so vague. I can't tell what you would like done, specifically, to end things like the "hegemony of pop culture" and the "culture of meaninglessness and sensitivity".

I would like you to give up all of your preconceptions and criticize everything and actively criticize pop culture as a whole.

Eventually, I would like to see a wide enough base that it could be directed towards physical destruction of institutions and human lives.

Originally Posted by ZeldaQueen

So that's how you think genders are. Fair enough to a degree. Men and women do have different hormone and chemical balances. But that only accounts for so much.

There are plenty of women who think that they should concentrate on careers. There are just as many women who prefer to be stay-at-home moms who cook and clean while their husbands go to work. There are women who take care of kids while keeping a job. I don't feel that society insists that a woman put career ahead of everything else.

I also don't see any notion that men ought to behave "like women". I fail to see how being "moderated in behavior" is something wrong. Some men simply are more emotional or at least show it (just because a person doesn't cry outright doesn't mean they don't cry).

Another thing to consider is that people don't act "feminine" or "masculine" 24/7. There're girls who are on sports teams who also dress up and go to prom with their boyfriends. There're guys who are plenty tough but also are sensitive. My brother can be aggressive, but he also cries and is emotional. My cousin is funny and sensitive, but he also takes wrestling and once hit another guy who wouldn't stop bothering him. My best friend is all for equal rights for women, but she also dresses up for dances and goes out on dates.

I guess what I'm saying is that "feminine" and "masculine" aren't switches. A person isn't one or the other. Everyone is - and always has - had a blend of the traits you consider to fall into these categories. Simply because it's become culturally acceptable to show these traits doesn't mean it's just started happening.

I agree with your points and I think perhaps we disagree mostly just on emphasis.

What I would like to hear your opinion on concerns how you feel about the modern culture emasculating males...

Or do you think this doesn't happen?

Originally Posted by b_squared

Why does # 3 sound like cultural, ethnic, spirtual cleansing? Oh, but thats ok though right? After all we have #1, we have our morality. It will not tolerate anyone else's ideas of what's moral. We reject what is decient because to do so is dignified. We reject the control others force upon us to tolerate others decency because we have the liberty do so, and that makes it ok. People who are decent, and tolerant, and work to acheive peace are vain and untruthful. People should not get paid for their time. People should not enlighten themselfes with higher learning because the simpler you are the easier it is to believe in #1-7.

No thank you. I have the liberty to reject your morals, because I can see the truth behind them.

After reading to you explanations to support your thesis I can conclude that you have acheived only # 7. Number 6 is within reach though if you have time to post as often as you do.

There would be nothing ethnic about the cleansing, but to some extent it would be a cultural cleansing that focused on replacing it with liberty.

[Kulturkampf]

Originally Posted by Big Papa Goat

you know, the hatebreed ethics seminar was about us lol'ing @ you, not w/ you.

Just so we're clear.

You're a faggot with a stupid name.

Originally Posted by kahljorn

Communism is ridiculous precisely because its utopian and theoretically inevitable. It's pointless to even bring into a discussion.

Yep.

[Kulturkampf]

Originally Posted by ZeldaQueen

Right. I really can't see how your whole "Islam isn't nearly as targeted" thing works when there're people after September 11th who have taken on the "only good Muslim is a dead Muslim" idea. Which, I think, is the stupidest thing I've ever heard. Judaism, Christianity, and Islam are the only three religions in the world who worship one God (the rest are polythesitic). They started in the same area and have the same people in their religions.

I believe there is also a Vietnamese religion that is monotheist... Just to... Let you know...

I also think Sikhism is monotheist...

Originally Posted by Jeanette X

Who gives a shit? For someone who isn't a Christian, you certainly have your panties in a knot over who is and who isn't. And by the way, the mainstream LDS hasn't practiced polygamy in over 100 years, not that it contradicts the Bible to do so.

The New Testament doesn't support polygamy, so if we are talking about the Bible from a Christian standpoint, you should consider fucking off back to the Library for a refresher.

[Jeanette X]

Originally Posted by Kulturkampf

I believe there is also a Vietnamese religion that is monotheist... Just to... Let you know...

I also think Sikhism is monotheist...



The New Testament doesn't support polygamy, so if we are talking about the Bible from a Christian standpoint, you should consider fucking off back to the Library for a refresher.

The OLD TESTAMENT supports it, you twatwaffle. Or is the Old Testament totally irrelevant to Christianity in your opinion?

[Kulturkampf]

Originally Posted by Jeanette X

The OLD TESTAMENT supports it, you twatwaffle. Or is the Old Testament totally irrelevant to Christianity in your opinion?

Anything Christ made irrelevant is certainly... Irrelevant.

Christ spoke of marriage as the union of a man and a woman; polygamy is a thing of the past in Christian belief and doctrine.

[ZeldaQueen]

Originally Posted by Kulturkampf

I believe there is also a Vietnamese religion that is monotheist... Just to... Let you know...

I also think Sikhism is monotheist...

Technically Sikhism's more of a philosophy and has no definite concept of God (they define God as the Universe).

The Vietnamese religions are various forms of Buddhism (which has no "God" but the lifeforce of Nirvana, as Buddha is simply a man who first achieved enlightenment), with the later additions of Christianity (no explanation needed I hope), Islam (again, I said it was monotheistic), and Hinduism (which is very much polytheisitic).

You might be thinking of Confucianism or Daoism? Confucianism is not so much a religion as a way to live your life ethically, through various codes of conduct and the "gentlemanly arts". Daoism is a religion that calls for the respect of ancestors and the balance of nature and elements of our spirit (it's a bit difficult to explain). There is, as far as I know, no definite "God" image as it is more of a blend of religious views and philosophy than actual religion (this is where the concept of Ying and Yang come from).

If you remember what this religion you're thinking of is called, please tell me (I'm fascinated by religions, as you can probably tell).

[ZeldaQueen]

I agree with your points and I think perhaps we disagree mostly just on emphasis.

What I would like to hear your opinion on concerns how you feel about the modern culture emasculating males...

Or do you think this doesn't happen?

I'd say so. I do enjoy a good debate though.

Fair enough. I really don't notice "emasculation" so much as society saying "It's alright to step out of the mold". If it's one thing about feminism that does bother me, it's when it gets to the extreme of "We don't need any men at all! We must dominate!"

I realize, of course, that is at the very end of a spectrum, but my point is that if women are allowed to step out of their former society roles (June Cleaver or the pretty secretary/telephone operator) men ought to be allowed the same privillege should they desire it. That's the key. As I said before, there are women who want to build a career and women who want to be homemakers. That should be their decision. Either path has its own merits and neither is (to me) dishonorable.

It is the same with men. There are, I know, lots of men who would choose to go out and take a job and be the breadwinners. Or be athletes. Or something like that. And there are also men who would be happy staying at home and caring for their children. Or becoming art majors. It's who they are as a person.

Some women are, let's face it, just not the kind of person who ought to be a mother. Maybe it's because of emotional problems or difficulty committing to something like raising a child or just because she doesn't think she'd be ready for it. If that's the case, there's no reason why it should be expected of her. If she honestly is unable to settle to a "traditional" female life, she can, in this day and age, go for something else.

Same with men. Some men just are more suited for roles in society like being a stay-at-home dad. To me, there's nothing at all wrong with that. It's a worthwhile thing to do (it provides bonding between the child and the father).

Now out of curiosity, how do you see men as being "effeminised"? (If such a word exists... )

[kahljorn]

I bet KK throws up on his own penis and masturbates with the vomit.

[Dr. Boogie]

Originally Posted by Kulturkampf

I would like you to give up all of your preconceptions and criticize everything and actively criticize pop culture as a whole.

My preconceptions of what? Ah, screw it. Lemme give this a shot:


Pop culture sure is lousy.


Ok, I've criticized pop culture as a whole. Now what?

Eventually, I would like to see a wide enough base that it could be directed towards physical destruction of institutions and human lives.

Which institutions? And don't say "institutions that _____". What specific existing institutions would you like to see rent asunder with physical violence? And who do you want to see physically destroyed?

[Kulturkampf]

found it, Zelda:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cao_Dai

It is interesting, and monotheist.

[Zhukov]

Haha, you were both arguing about it not too long ago, and both using it as an example to further your points of view.

[ZeldaQueen]

Ah, thank you! Looks like that's a newer one (my classes covered the older religions, Christianity, Judaism, Islam, Shintoism, Buddhism, Hinduism, those ones), so that'd probably be why I missed it.

[kahljorn]

yea, but not the ideal perfect form which begs the question of whether it is ideal and perfect or even possible ;\.
Sorry to say, but people criticize communism for the reasons I listed all the fucking time. It removes incentives to work. It is totalitarian. But then for you to come into the thread and say, "Well communism is supposed to be perfect so you guys dont know what you';'re talking about." and, "Modern examples of communism aren't actual communism" is sheer bullshit. They are examples of communism, and people use it as criticisms of marxist theory.
BUT COMMUNISM IS SUPPOSED TO BE PERFECT. Well, the point of the criticisms people bring up is that IT CANT BE PERFECT. UT ITS SUPPOSED TO BE PERFECT SO IF YOU CRITICIZE COMMUNISM AND ITS NOT PERFECT COMMUNISM THEN ITS NOT COMMUNISM AND YOU ARENT CRITICIZING COMMUNISM.


i dont think i ever used communism to further my point of view ;\

[Kulturkampf]

Yeah, I am not even sure how I came to know of this... I just remembered hearing about it once.

[kahljorn]

Somewhere in the world im sure there's another obscure religious sect that is monotheistic Reading about Cao Dai its extremely clear that its basically derived from buddhists which were converted to christianity and became an amalgam of many religions.

really it seems more like its pantheistic (panentheism? whatever) than monotheistic. *shrug* You could argue that hinduism is monotheistic, and some people do believe it is monotheistic. You could in a sense say the same about buddhism...

People talk shit on islam all the time. Except that, Islam has hella bigger issues. Their treatment of women, for example. Its crazy to even imagine somebody saying that people don't make a big deal out of Islam ;\
Most of the people I know consider islamic countries like third world countries or something. Maybe that's part of the reason: these countries are just seen as medieval. And really, their problems aren't really that relevant to our own. Although, we've made them ours, haven't we? We've been trying to democratize them for the last few years. Tons of people make a huge issue out of trying to make it less rigid over there. Again: there's just more important issues with these other countries. We couldn't even get started on "Gay rights." I mean, are there really "Rights" in the modern sense of the word in Islamic countries?
tyrrany is pretty much targetted world-wide, but what can we really do about chinese tyranny in america? Our arguments have no affect on it. Neither does our attention. Not only that, but their problems are irrelevant to our own, and we aren't going to advance our culture by focusing on their failures.

Also you're an idiot. Christianity isn't "The main target." It might be at the focal point for issues IN AMERICA about Gay rights (or god in the classroom or any numerous other religious issues), but that's because america is a predominantly christian nation. With a predominantly christian heritage. And most of the people pushing for no gay marriage (or other religious based ideas) are christian, not islamic. So why would they be targeted? What the fuck do we have to include every obscure religion which is against gay marriage into our condemnation -- even when its not relevant to the problem? Most people don't even know which religions are against it.

Also, most of the atheists in this country, and other christian nations, probably used to be christian. So they have angst. Not only that, but most people probably don't even know shit about islam other than that its where terrorists come from and they are medieval asshats. Also its usually christians that target the atheists (in america).

Also I'm pretty sure Islam is the largest religion in the world.

Yes, Christians have done unchristian things but if you look at the nations with a Christian heritage today you will find that they are the freest nations on Earth.

Yea, and most of the reason why they are freest is because they move away from christian religious values.

you start the dumbest threads.

The fact that Christian values are taken so seriously in, for example, politics really annoys people because of the whole church/state separation thing.

I think this pretty much sums it up. Less islamic/judaic people are trying to force their religious values down other people's throats. Christianity gets the limelight, simply because, in america, they are in the limelight. It all has to do with proximity.

[kahljorn]

Also gay marriage isnt the last bastion. What about abortion?

The other night i saw a huge anti-abortion gathering. They bought the building across the street from the abortion clinic and named it something like, "FAMILY PLANNING" or some shit and they entice people to come inside (not knowing its an anti-abortion place) and then they bombard them with anti-abortion pamphlets and pictures of aborted third trimester fetuses. They also harass women going in to have abortions.

the church across the street sets up crosses for ALL THE ABORTED BABIES. *shrug*

[VaporTrailx1]

The reason gay-marriage is such an issue is that it is sort of a turning point. Cause then polygamists would have ammo for their cause, then who knows what from there. There is but 1 solution to stop this. Abolish Marriage As A State Institution. Think about it, it makes sense. Call it the Domestic Mutually Assured Destruction policy.

Interesting fact : The Crusades only killed about 1.5 million people on each side. But many people believe it to be 45 million+ for some reason. The population of Europe wasn't even 35 million in 1300. However, the Black Plague cut that in half by 1450.

[kahljorn]

Kulturkamph is a woman I want at my gang bang; she is a woman of staunch bonors and grates a steed.

how's that for a review.

lol who the fuck gives reviews about people.

[kahljorn]

They should just let polygamists get married, too.

[Kulturkampf]

Originally Posted by kahljorn

Somewhere in the world im sure there's another obscure religious sect that is monotheistic Reading about Cao Dai its extremely clear that its basically derived from buddhists which were converted to christianity and became an amalgam of many religions.

really it seems more like its pantheistic (panentheism? whatever) than monotheistic. *shrug* You could argue that hinduism is monotheistic, and some people do believe it is monotheistic. You could in a sense say the same about buddhism...

Yeah, I heard that and thought of mentioning monotheism for Hinduism. I once read some fo that Hare Krsna shit. It was OK.

Also you're an idiot. Christianity isn't "The main target." It might be at the focal point for issues IN AMERICA about Gay rights (or god in the classroom or any numerous other religious issues), but that's because america is a predominantly christian nation. With a predominantly christian heritage. And most of the people pushing for no gay marriage (or other religious based ideas) are christian, not islamic. So why would they be targeted? What the fuck do we have to include every obscure religion which is against gay marriage into our condemnation -- even when its not relevant to the problem? Most people don't even know which religions are against it.

Yeah, you're a fucking douche.

It is funny how you try to play this off.

You act like the world is only as big as the West.

you start the dumbest threads.

And you're a closed minded prick who has never ventured out of his fucking backyard, you fucking clown.

I am sorry I do not live in fucking douche-baggia who thinks it is an issue that Christians keep their dying campaigns going, represented by a vocal minority.

Christianity has been largely divorced from civil society for a long time... Why would it even be a target or even worth discussing?

The Muslims are already fucking shit up in Europe, bro. Do you live there? Or in America?

(and they've been fucking south Asia longer)

Originally Posted by kahljorn

Also gay marriage isnt the last bastion. What about abortion?

The other night i saw a huge anti-abortion gathering. They bought the building across the street from the abortion clinic and named it something like, "FAMILY PLANNING" or some shit and they entice people to come inside (not knowing its an anti-abortion place) and then they bombard them with anti-abortion pamphlets and pictures of aborted third trimester fetuses. They also harass women going in to have abortions.

the church across the street sets up crosses for ALL THE ABORTED BABIES. *shrug*

So they have a fun time wasting their money.

Originally Posted by VaporTrailx1

The reason gay-marriage is such an issue is that it is sort of a turning point. Cause then polygamists would have ammo for their cause, then who knows what from there. There is but 1 solution to stop this. Abolish Marriage As A State Institution. Think about it, it makes sense. Call it the Domestic Mutually Assured Destruction policy.

Interesting fact : The Crusades only killed about 1.5 million people on each side. But many people believe it to be 45 million+ for some reason. The population of Europe wasn't even 35 million in 1300. However, the Black Plague cut that in half by 1450.

I agree with everythign said here.

You shoudl also add "abolish the majority of the government; deregulate everything; cut off Hollywood actor's heads and massacre MTV."

Originally Posted by kahljorn

They should just let polygamists get married, too.

Yep.

[kahljorn]

You act like the world is only as big as the West.

Yea? Is christianity a huge target of atheists and pro gay marriage folk in non-western countries?

thinks it is an issue that Christians keep their dying campaigns going, represented by a vocal minority.

Prop 8 was passed in california. Not much of a dying campaign. Bush got voted into office largely because everybody wanted a MORAL person in office.
Being christian is always a big issue during election times...

So they have a fun time wasting their money.

You're the one who said it was their last bastion or whatever.

The Muslims are already fucking shit up in Europe, bro. Do you live there? Or in America?

Do you?

[Kulturkampf]

Originally Posted by kahljorn

Kulturkamph is a woman I want at my gang bang; she is a woman of staunch bonors and grates a steed.

how's that for a review.

lol who the fuck gives reviews about people.

haha, yeah.

Originally Posted by Dr. Boogie

My preconceptions of what? Ah, screw it. Lemme give this a shot:


Pop culture sure is lousy.


Ok, I've criticized pop culture as a whole. Now what?



Which institutions? And don't say "institutions that _____". What specific existing institutions would you like to see rent asunder with physical violence? And who do you want to see physically destroyed?

I will think about this and get back to you..

Generally speaking, I would like to see any institutions which attempt to regulate personal freedom destroyed -- that is to say, the federal and state governments themselves who come up with things like smoking bands, red tape for establishing businesses, who criminalize fun, who regulate alcohol and drug use, etc.

Originally Posted by kahljorn

I bet KK throws up on his own penis and masturbates with the vomit.

Now that is not quite right...

Originally Posted by ZeldaQueen

I'd say so. I do enjoy a good debate though.

Fair enough. I really don't notice "emasculation" so much as society saying "It's alright to step out of the mold". If it's one thing about feminism that does bother me, it's when it gets to the extreme of "We don't need any men at all! We must dominate!"

I realize, of course, that is at the very end of a spectrum, but my point is that if women are allowed to step out of their former society roles (June Cleaver or the pretty secretary/telephone operator) men ought to be allowed the same privillege should they desire it. That's the key. As I said before, there are women who want to build a career and women who want to be homemakers. That should be their decision. Either path has its own merits and neither is (to me) dishonorable.

It is the same with men. There are, I know, lots of men who would choose to go out and take a job and be the breadwinners. Or be athletes. Or something like that. And there are also men who would be happy staying at home and caring for their children. Or becoming art majors. It's who they are as a person.

Some women are, let's face it, just not the kind of person who ought to be a mother. Maybe it's because of emotional problems or difficulty committing to something like raising a child or just because she doesn't think she'd be ready for it. If that's the case, there's no reason why it should be expected of her. If she honestly is unable to settle to a "traditional" female life, she can, in this day and age, go for something else.

Same with men. Some men just are more suited for roles in society like being a stay-at-home dad. To me, there's nothing at all wrong with that. It's a worthwhile thing to do (it provides bonding between the child and the father).

Now out of curiosity, how do you see men as being "effeminised"? (If such a word exists... )

Men are adopting far more feminine and prissy fashions; the emo thing is trying to convince men that crying and bitching is a proper pasttime; even hip hop has come to such a point of strange vanity that it is disgusting.

Everybody lives in a plastic world.

Everybody wants to pretend life is a romantic comedy.

I could go on about this... But it would be its own thread. we can do this later.

[Dr. Boogie]

Originally Posted by Kulturkampf

Generally speaking, I would like to see any institutions which attempt to regulate personal freedom destroyed -- that is to say, the federal and state governments themselves who come up with things like smoking bands, red tape for establishing businesses, who criminalize fun, who regulate alcohol and drug use, etc.

I knew you couldn't handle that request. I thought there was a faint chance you might actually name a specific institution, but you've been avoiding specifics ever since you came back.

Forget about my asking for specific people. Just say something like "the people who perpetuate the feminine values and think war is bad".

[Jeanette X]

Originally Posted by Kulturkampf

Anything Christ made irrelevant is certainly... Irrelevant.

Christ spoke of marriage as the union of a man and a woman; polygamy is a thing of the past in Christian belief and doctrine.

So why do you squeal in outrage over gay relationships, and yet you don't breathe a word about divorce, which is expressly condemned in the New Testament save in the case of adultery:

31"It has been said, 'Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce.'a]" class="footnote">[a] 32But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery. -Matthew 5:31-32

Why do you call LGBT supportive Christians hypocrites and yet seem so apathetic about divorce for reasons other than adultery?

[kahljorn]

cause he's a silly fucking idiot.