Religious Evolution

[kilmie polanski]

DONT NOBODY TELL VINTH THAT JESUS WAS A JEW B/C I'M SURE VINTHTH JESUS LIKES BIGOTRY AND STEREOTYPING

[Vibecrewangel]

Thanks Proto

It is an over simplification, but in some cases it is better to leave things simple because the more you try to explain it the more convoluted it gets. And the basic concept often gets clouded by your own opinion. Kind of a Buddhist concept.

Face it, what Jesus taught was probably pretty simple too. But too much explanation of some very simple concepts and we have one of the most convoluted, clouded by opinion books in the world.

[Vibecrewangel]

Relgion are temporal and subjective beliefs about morals, rules, ect that follow the needs of the given culture. Cultures are different and subject to change, therefore religions are different and subject to change.

Very nice!

[kellychaos]

Thanks. I was only repeating what others already said in a different way, though.

[Protoclown]

I meant no insult, Vibe. There is often great wisdom in simplicity. I just didn't want to paint myself completely into a corner since I don't think that Mother Theresa and someone who goes around killing babies are necessarily going to find themselves at the same end point of the path. But in a general way, yes, I think that all religions more or less achieve the same end goal.

[Vibecrewangel]

I know you didn't. I apreciate the fact that you seem to always understand what I am saying.

[The_voice_of_reason]

It is my sincere hope that we can let go of religion and whorship the fact that we are alive. Isn't existing enough? Why do we have to go looking for a reason to be alive? Religion can come to no good end.

Now I am not saying that we should throw out all religious teachings, just that we should recognise them for what they are products of MANS innovation and desire to know.

Now I am not naive, I know that this will never happen. People just get too attached to there deities. People kill for there deities. People die for there deities. This is why religion is inherently evil.


P.S. Peanut butter and chocolate cream oreos kick so much ass.

[mburbank]

LOOK OUT! ITH MY CHRITHT KILLING DETHENDANTS! THEY'RE BUILDING A TIME MATHINE!

[Bennett]

Max, it would be just like the terminator.

[FS]

I have fantastic ideas for religion. Simplicity and love, and shit. I just wish they'd take off.

[ItalianStereotype]

Originally Posted by The_voice_of_reason

It is my sincere hope that we can let go of religion and whorship the fact that we are alive. Isn't existing enough? Why do we have to go looking for a reason to be alive? Religion can come to no good end.

Now I am not saying that we should throw out all religious teachings, just that we should recognise them for what they are products of MANS innovation and desire to know.

Now I am not naive, I know that this will never happen. People just get too attached to there deities. People kill for there deities. People die for there deities. This is why religion is inherently evil.


P.S. Peanut butter and chocolate cream oreos kick so much ass.

so basically it's "My views are right, religion is wrong. People with faith are all misled fools." I would very much like to give you the most savage beating of your life.

[AChimp]

Shit, Vinth. You've resorted to hacking Italian's account now?

[Sethomas]

People kill for there deities. People die for there deities. This is why religion is inherently evil.

You have to admit, that's a huge fucking jump of logic. The actions of the minority do not reflect a flaw in the system, it represents an error in human nature itself. Unless you are suggesting a godless society would be pure of violent crimes, you make no good point I would expect better from one with such a pretentious title.

Furthermore, the cases in which murder happens for reasons of faith are extremely rare, and normally are associated strictly with the occult. Take the most obvious examples. The Crusades had practically nothing to do with religion. The degree to which Urban II's proclamation "Deus vult" was manipulated out of his hands makes evident that an economic and political struggle between Europe and the Middle East was inevitable, and the arbitrary slaughter in Constantinople during the first campaign makes obvious the fact that religion was utterly a non-issue. Otherwise, the pacts between the Templars and the Hashishens would have been impossible.

The Inquisition, though quite unsavory in itself, was a sociological safety valve forged by political conservativism. This should be obvious from the fact that executions could ONLY be administered by the State, as pre-existing cannon law forbade the clergy from spilling any blood. The English Inquisition executed Joan of Arc because they were terrified of her success. The French Inquisition executed witches and Cathars because public unrest demanded scapegoats for the plague and other travesties. The Spanish Inquisition executed Jews because the nobility was sick of their economic power. The Italian Inquisition executed Bruno because his eccentricity was fraying the scientific community of its integrity. None of these death's were justified, but NONE of them happened by group one enforcing beliefs upon group two.

Your tone also spoke lowly of the willingness to die for one's beliefs. It seems obvious to me that if you're unwilling to die for what you truly care about, you are a weak and pathetic being.

[ItalianStereotype]

Originally Posted by AChimp

Shit, Vinth. You've resorted to hacking Italian's account now?

oh come now chimp, allow me some indignation before comparing me to vince. im never not to speaking bad as much for now Vince as me.. simple as that enough said?

[The_voice_of_reason]

Originally Posted by "ItalianStereotype

so basically it's "My views are right, religion is wrong. People with faith are all misled fools." I would very much like to give you the most savage beating of your life.

Yes it is basically "My views are right, religion is wrong. People with fait are all misled fools." Instead of "My views are right, your religion is wrong. People who don't believe in my faith are wrong." I wish that I could lie and say that i take everyones views with equal reverence, but i will be honest and say that i do feel my views are better that everyone elses. Hell that is why they are my views. But i do know that you are entitled to your views and i would never do or say anything to jeopardize that. I was just stating what i think would help humanity the most. I mean, come on, you know you think your views are superior to everyone elses. So please suppress your desire to give me a severe beating.

[Sethomas]

Come on, tv. By cowering out of a beatdown, you're neglecting a perfectly good chance to make a hypocrite out of him.

Shame you can't have it both ways, you know.

[ItalianStereotype]

enlighten me winston, how could he have made a hypocrite of me? I would never really want to beat him, despite the sheer arrogance of his idea that all people of faith only perpetuate the worlds problems.

[Sethomas]

Because of the fact that you don't associate yourself with a religion that espouses itself with violence. By the flavor of your posts, you seem to belong to the Christian Right. If you were a true Italian stereotype, and if memory serves me then you are, you would be Roman Catholic. Beating one's fellow man would be contrary to the Christian paradigms such as "turn the other cheek" and "love thy neighbor," thus making hypocritical any violent means to asserting the rightness of your religion.

[ItalianStereotype]

I am a Roman Catholic (with faults) and I do try to practice "turning the other cheek." as I said, I would never truly beat, or wish him any harm for that matter. you seem to be nitpicking here, very few are able to follow their respective religious codes to the letter.

[Sethomas]

I'm no saint, so I wouldn't dare hold anyone to that standard. The jab was originally intended for vox boy.

[VinceZeb]

So, Voice, people who believe in God or have religious faith are fools.... man, you would really hate to see a list of the people who had faith. I'm sure many of them wouldn't qualify as being "fools".

If there is nothing in this life that you believe that is greater than you and you have nothing you would give your life for, then you really are living a pitiful existance. Mankind is not the end all be all of existance. I am sorry to shed some light on the dark hole you live in, but this is the truth. If you believe mankind is the pinnacle of existance or at least the earth, then you can be on the side of druggie porno stars, scientist who haven't seen the sunlight in umpteen years, and frumpy second-rate comedians.

Now, to Sethomas, please do not bring up the whole "turn the other cheek" speech. Have you ever read the Bible? Jesus talked a lot about throwing down in the Good Book. Let's face facts, Jesus was peaceful until it came to His Father or the evils of the world. Then Jesus didn't take no gruff. Jesus told people who didn't follow Him that the afterlife was going to be a very unpleasant experience.

But voice, continue to believe your views are right. See, if you are right, then me and you have gained nothing, but have ventured nothing. If I am right... well, I hope eternity in Hell leaves you with enough time to comtemplate how much of a dumbshit you are.

And trust me, if I wanted to "hack someone's account", I wouldn't hack a 3rd-rate player like IS.

[AChimp]

oh come now chimp, allow me some indignation before comparing me to vince. im never not to speaking bad as much for now Vince as me.. simple as that enough said?

PRROOOOOOFFF!!!

If there is nothing in this life that you believe that is greater than you and you have nothing you would give your life for, then you really are living a pitiful existance. Mankind is not the end all be all of existance. I am sorry to shed some light on the dark hole you live in, but this is the truth.

You know, Vinth, most agnostics/athiests don't think that humans are very special. In fact, I think humans are merely fleshy bags of mostly water. The only thing that separates us from other animals is the fact that we have the ability to create and use technology.

If you believe mankind is the pinnacle of existance or at least the earth,

Earth ain't so special, either. It's just a big ol' ball of mud floating through space.

Say... weren't you the one a few threads ago saying that you don't think humans are the same as all other animals?

Let's face facts, Jesus was peaceful until it came to His Father or the evils of the world. Then Jesus didn't take no gruff. Jesus told people who didn't follow Him that the afterlife was going to be a very unpleasant experience.

Wow... he didn't take any guff by giving them a stern lecture.

I hate to break this to you, Vinth, but that's still non-violent. I don't recall reading anything about Jesus promising beat-downs to those who didn't believe in him or threatening to jizz on the face of those who disagreed.

If I am right... well, I hope eternity in Hell leaves you with enough time to comtemplate how much of a dumbshit you are.

Judging by all the conversations I've had with really religious people, I'm sure that Hell is full of far more interesting people.

[ItalianStereotype]

Originally Posted by VinceZeb

And trust me, if I wanted to "hack someone's account", I wouldn't hack a 3rd-rate player like IS.

what makes me 3rd-rate Vince? the ability to communicate clearly? my habit of only arguing if i feel that i am able to prove my claims? the fact that i don't leave various unsubstantiated rumors hanging over my head?

[Protoclown]

Originally Posted by VinceZeb

man, you would really hate to see a list of the people who had faith. I'm sure many of them wouldn't qualify as being "fools".

Well, you certainly do.

[Brandon]

Personally, I don't buy into any sort of "higher meaning" or "higher presence" in the world. If there is one (or many), though, it's probably completely out of our comprehension and frankly, doesn't seem to affect us much in our daily life.

Read Camus' "The Myth of Sisyphus." Life, when going purely on the evidence we have around us, pretty much seems an absurd exercise with no pay-off. It's just one big study in excess.

With that said, it's a glorious excess, and I enjoy being alive. I don't need a reason or motivation to live...I'm simply going to just live.